Texas Debate: 2/21/08

[CGP]

I really hope Hillary pulls out all stops tonight! This is one of two last chances to really show Obama up! She has to do it! There is a great article at ABC New today which explore what Hillary's potential strategies might be. It's a good read. I submitted a somewhat "heated" comment! Which strategy of those he mentions do you think Hillary should opt?? I went for option one - throw everything including the kicthen sink at Obama and give it everything!

http://blogs.abcnews.com/matthewdowd/2008/02/team-clinton-fa.html

[CGP]

See below for the comment I submitted in relation to the article above discussing tonight's debate:

Thanks for an interesting analogy. I think it's a useful way to view the current situation. In terms of strategy, I would strongly anticipate that Clinton will adopt position #1 - she is in this race to win it. Make no mistake about that. And rightly so. Why should she cave and concede to a sexist media and a woefully gullable public???

Under no circumstances must she accept this. She should fight to the end and the Democratic party should get what it deserves if this leads to a massive party split! Let's put a few things in perspective! The notion that Barack Obama has majority national support across Democrats is comlete nonsense. As at 2/20/08: 10,600,000 votes had been cast for for Clinton and 10,900,000 votes for Obama - yes, almost a 50/50 split and yet the media would have the public believe that Clinton's support has crashed to a grinding halt and that Obama is the national favorite crusing to victory. If the latter happens he has his buddies in the media to thank for that one!

Rest assured a large chunk of those 50% of people who voted for Clinton will not be willingly throwing their support around Obama. His behavior, and his campaign's behavior, have turned off many a Clinton supporter. Arrogance, sexism, dismissiveness, pretentiousness. These are highly unattractive qualities and not those befitting of a leader of the Democratic party. So I say - go for it Clinton - take this to the very end - you don't owe anybody anything after the way you have been treated during this nomination process.

[skc1976]

See below for the comment I submitted in relation to the article above discussing tonight's debate:

Thanks for an interesting analogy. I think it's a useful way to view the current situation. In terms of strategy, I would strongly anticipate that Clinton will adopt position #1 - she is in this race to win it. Make no mistake about that. And rightly so. Why should she cave and concede to a sexist media and a woefully gullable public???

Under no circumstances must she accept this. She should fight to the end and the Democratic party should get what it deserves if this leads to a massive party split! Let's put a few things in perspective! The notion that Barack Obama has majority national support across Democrats is comlete nonsense. As at 2/20/08: 10,600,000 votes had been cast for for Clinton and 10,900,000 votes for Obama - yes, almost a 50/50 split and yet the media would have the public believe that Clinton's support has crashed to a grinding halt and that Obama is the national favorite crusing to victory. If the latter happens he has his buddies in the media to thank for that one!

Rest assured a large chunk of those 50% of people who voted for Clinton will not be willingly throwing their support around Obama. His behavior, and his campaign's behavior, have turned off many a Clinton supporter. Arrogance, sexism, dismissiveness, pretentiousness. These are highly unattractive qualities and not those befitting of a leader of the Democratic party. So I say - go for it Clinton - take this to the very end - you don't owe anybody anything after the way you have been treated during this nomination process.

Here here! I raise my glass to you and give you kudos on a wonderful article!!!!

I, too, think she needs to go for broke and let her opponent have it. It's clear he's not good at debates and it's clear that when pressured for real answers, he either stammers or says "I agree with Senator Clinton." Being buddies worked at the last debate and probably helped Hillary with Super Tuesday, but since then, he's tried to align his policies closer to hers, including ripping off quite a few of the solutions she's already presented. Why? To tap into her base and then put into that pretty little box called "change." I don't want change, I want a leader. I don't want Barack Obama, I want Hillary Clinton! RANSACK BARACK TONIGHT!

And remember this: it's not about "yes we can," it's about "yes we will." So keep up the fight and "GIVE 'EM HILL!"

[Angelica91]

I can say one thing:"Hillary, I am with you, good luck! Shows all the world you're the best!"
yes, we want to change...but we want to change with Hillary!

and so...YES WE WILL!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[CGP]

The ending was BRILLIANT. I LOVED IT. That was so heartfelt and moving. I hope this impacts the public in the way that it should.

[BloodDAnna]

http://www.youpolls.com/details.asp?pid=1763
Vote for Hillary on the above poll regarding this debate.

Loved it, again I see why she is the most qualified

[CGP]

AND SUBMIT POSITIVE COMMENTS TO THIS CNN BLOG ABOUT THE ENDING:

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/02/21/schneider-clinton-ends-on-a-strong-note/

My comment was (10.30pm):

I salute you Hillary Clinton. Your ending to tonight's debate was the single most inspiring moment I have seen throughout this presidential race thus far. Granted both you and your opponent are intelligent, capable and well-spoken. But tonight you connected with me, with America, and with real people. You closing remarks were the kinds of words I would expect from a president who can not only work for the American people but understand their daily struggles as well. You are a fighter, a doer, a realist. But you are also a remarkable human being with a tremendous capacity to understand the needs and hopes of those less fortunate than yourself. Thank you. You have my vote, but more importantly you have my belief in the hope and potential of your presidential candidacy.

And then this (10.40pm):

It is disturbing to read through some of these comments and note the venom and disdain from some of Obama's supporters. Can you not ever concede some strengths in his opponent!? In this comment I will not stoop to your level. Please practice what your leader is encouraging you to do - to joing together, unite, for a common good. This contast slandering and abuse of Hillary Clinton is extremely unattractive and highly damaging to your candidate - if this is the kind of reaction he inspires in his supporters, who would want to support him? Please be dignified in your analyses and acknowledge that each candidate has strengths and weaknesses. To dismiss Hillary Clinton's last statement as empty rhetoric and as insincere highlights your awareness of how much of a potential impact that final statement had on viewers - why else would you feel the need to critique it? Please behave in a way which if respectiful to your leader. He would not condone such slander and poor sportsmanship. Thank you.

-----

[Brooke]

http://www.youpolls.com/details.asp?pid=1763
Vote for Hillary on the above poll regarding this debate.

Loved it, again I see why she is the most qualified

Who are the idiots voting for Obama? He did NOT win this debate.

[CGP]

These kinds of online polls aren't useful or fair. Obama, we know, has a bigger youth following and young people are more accustomed to the world of the internet. Not surprisingly he can always win these online polls as there are a large chunk of his fans sitting online! I don't think the same applies to Hillary's base. I voted anway.

[UNBREAKABLE]

I must say, the message is still dry Hilary! You need pizzazzzzz in your message! The Debate was your opportunity to grandstand him, you didn't capitalize on digs you could have gotten in. He has improved on his debating skills, you are level with yours. We need more from you and your writers to take Obama out.

The ending kicked ass, Hilary got the last word.

[CGP]

The ending kicked ass, Hilary got the last word.

For me, this had more weight than everything that went before it - by either candidate. I think he did have some strong moments, as she did, but this last statement was the clincher. She crossed the line first I believe with this, with a mixture of humanity and vision.

[UNBREAKABLE]

I think she crossed the line first also, but it could have been a runaway she missed a couple opportunities that made the difference. She speaks of herself like a resume, there is no flair there. She has it all except flair, it makes her come across dry, while he comes across like a Rockstar! I would like to see fire in her, like the 4th of July,,,Shine on Hilary, shine on!

[pennylane8510]

AND SUBMIT POSITIVE COMMENTS TO THIS CNN BLOG ABOUT THE ENDING:

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/02/21/schneider-clinton-ends-on-a-strong-note/

My comment was (10.30pm):

I salute you Hillary Clinton. Your ending to tonight's debate was the single most inspiring moment I have seen throughout this presidential race thus far. Granted both you and your opponent are intelligent, capable and well-spoken. But tonight you connected with me, with America, and with real people. You closing remarks were the kinds of words I would expect from a president who can not only work for the American people but understand their daily struggles as well. You are a fighter, a doer, a realist. But you are also a remarkable human being with a tremendous capacity to understand the needs and hopes of those less fortunate than yourself. Thank you. You have my vote, but more importantly you have my belief in the hope and potential of your presidential candidacy.

And then this (10.40pm):

It is disturbing to read through some of these comments and note the venom and disdain from some of Obama's supporters. Can you not ever concede some strengths in his opponent!? In this comment I will not stoop to your level. Please practice what your leader is encouraging you to do - to joing together, unite, for a common good. This contast slandering and abuse of Hillary Clinton is extremely unattractive and highly damaging to your candidate - if this is the kind of reaction he inspires in his supporters, who would want to support him? Please be dignified in your analyses and acknowledge that each candidate has strengths and weaknesses. To dismiss Hillary Clinton's last statement as empty rhetoric and as insincere highlights your awareness of how much of a potential impact that final statement had on viewers - why else would you feel the need to critique it? Please behave in a way which if respectiful to your leader. He would not condone such slander and poor sportsmanship. Thank you.

-----

Well said Murray!! :cool:

I just made a comment on the CNN ticker:

Stephanie February 21st, 2008 11:02 pm ET
Your comment is awaiting moderation.
"Obama crushed her. She appeared timid and uncreative."

I don't know what you were watching Jeff…because it was very obvious that Hillary won the debate tonight. She is the one that crushed Obama…and got the standing ovation. Enough said.

I will be voting for Hillary Clinton in Dallas, TX on March 4th!

[UNBREAKABLE]

February 21st, 2008 11:35 pm ET
Your comment is awaiting moderation.
I'm sick and tired of hearing Obama say "I didn't vote for the war in Iraq", PEOPLE look at his senate voting record, HE DID NOT VOTE AT ALL!!!!!!!!!!!! He's a walking robot with the powers of magic that has casted spells on all the unknowing.

[CGP]

VIDEO OF HILLARY'S CLOSING COMMENTS!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NiaZ9WXbw1o

-----

[skc1976]

Hey Hillary supporters!

Well, another debate has come and gone and I have to say, I was very impressed and discouraged. I feel like someone waffling when having these feelings that are contradictory. Fortunately, it's not about the issues.

I'm going to start off with how I am impressed tonight. I am impressed with Hillary Clinton! As eight o'clock struck, my stomach went into knots and I was very nervous with how it would progress. I wanted so much for Hillary to throw that last minute touchdown or hit that bottom of the ninth home run. And, in my eyes, she did just that. I definitely feel there's another "playoff" game that can happen now.

My favorite highlight tonight is a tie. My first highlight, which the media has critized vastly, is her saying, "that's not change we can believe in, it's change we Xerox." For me, no truer words have been sent in the direction of Barack Obama than those. And let me tell you, John McCain has had some great early quips towards him. But this comment from her was amazing and something that a lot of her supporters have felt for sometime now. And yes, there will be backlash from it, but darn it, it's because they realize that she's right and they don't want to admit it. And she's right, actions do speak louder than words, especially those you Xerox.

The other highlight for me was the end. In a debate where Barack Obama had chance after chance to speak after she did and rebutt everything she said, or try to latch on to her coattails, her final statement was one of the most remarkable ending sentiments I've ever seen. Seeing that crowd rise to it's feet to applaud and cheer, not allowing any final remarks from anyone else showed me WHY I am a Hillary Clinton supporter. She is the REAL voice of America. It's not about getting the Toyota Center full of supporters to deliver eloquent speeches with bits and pieces taken from others. It's about being out there on the trail and seeing what is going on, what people are feeling, and knowing that we need someone that cares and shows compassion more than we need motivational speaking. Both of these comments from her, at different ends of the spectrum, defined what it means to cast a vote for Hillary Clinton.

Now, it's time for the discouraging aspects. First off, let's start with CNN. I get so sick and tired of their pointed and leading questions that they pose to Clinton and then present Obama with questions that are nothing of the like. I will give an exception to Campbell Brown who did hit him with a zinger about his stance back in 2003 compared to now. But, it's nothing like the constant fire they throw at Hillary.

Another thing that bothers me is how he's able to rebuttle almost every thing she has to say, but when he throws a dagger her way, she's expected to take it. For example, the heated discussion on Health Care and reforming it. They go to a commercial to keep Clinton from giving her retaliation to what Obama asserts. And when they come back, instead of keeping the conversation going, they try and change the topic. I give kudos to Hillary for not taking it and still getting her point out there. However, Barack still gets the last comment in. And Health Care was just one time when it happened. It happened far more than just that one issue.

Thirdly, the partisan and biased thoughts of the people they continuously ask opinions of on CNN. Before the debate even starts, Lou Dobbs (who I give credit to for trying to maintain some decency and impartiality) is talking with James Zogby. Zogby, who they show is an "Obama Supporter," is talking about how Michigan and Florida will remain stripped because it's their fault. And then references in Michigan how Democrats voted for Romney so that McCain wouldn't win, seeming as a statement that the results weren't an accurate tally of Democrats. Of course, he wasn't asked about the GOP (or recruitment of GOP voters) voting for Obama to ensure that Clinton would not get the nod and how that wasn't a fair representation of Democrats.

Another example that bothers me is in the "pre-game" show again the Latino representative they have on there. His biased and negative remarks towards "the Clinton's" and how no Latino should trust them should not be broadcast right before a debate, especially when there are so many Latino voters coming up in the Texas primary and there isn't another Latino there to defend Clinton. It's disturbing how biased that CNN is against Hillary Clinton and one reason that I'm disgusted with their network in this primary season.

And the last thing that disturbs me that I will touch on is how Obama is clearly trying to paint the "we're the same candidate, but I'm more enjoyable" picture. He continuously aligns himself with Hillary as to convince voters that a vote for Obama is a vote for her. So many times I heard him say that he agrees with her on the issues. And when she would present a contrast, outside of Health Care, he'd come around to align himself. I am sick of how he presents himself and always coming off as a follower rather than a leader. This behavior is not that of a Commander In Chief, but the behavior of a puppet. And it disgusts me how many people follow his rhetoric and mistake his positions as that of his own rather than following the lead of the stronger candidate.

Tonight just reaffirms me even more why I am in favor of Hillary Clinton. I'm tired of the public rallying around someone that is just being pulled by strings. But I'm not tired of someone that stands up for what they believe in and has a proven history of accomplishments and public service. I'm tired of Barack Obama. I'm not tired of Hillary Clinton.

I apologize for the length of the post. I had a lot to say about the debate. I look forward to reading more of your thoughts and any responses you have to mine. I'm going to start a new thread for the debate as well. Check that out. :-)

[CGP]

Hey Hillary supporters!

Well, another debate has come and gone and I have to say, I was very impressed and discouraged. I feel like someone waffling when having these feelings that are contradictory. Fortunately, it's not about the issues.

I'm going to start off with how I am impressed tonight. I am impressed with Hillary Clinton! As eight o'clock struck, my stomach went into knots and I was very nervous with how it would progress. I wanted so much for Hillary to throw that last minute touchdown or hit that bottom of the ninth home run. And, in my eyes, she did just that. I definitely feel there's another "playoff" game that can happen now.

My favorite highlight tonight is a tie. My first highlight, which the media has critized vastly, is her saying, "that's not change we can believe in, it's change we Xerox." For me, no truer words have been sent in the direction of Barack Obama than those. And let me tell you, John McCain has had some great early quips towards him. But this comment from her was amazing and something that a lot of her supporters have felt for sometime now. And yes, there will be backlash from it, but darn it, it's because they realize that she's right and they don't want to admit it. And she's right, actions do speak louder than words, especially those you Xerox.

The other highlight for me was the end. In a debate where Barack Obama had chance after chance to speak after she did and rebutt everything she said, or try to latch on to her coattails, her final statement was one of the most remarkable ending sentiments I've ever seen. Seeing that crowd rise to it's feet to applaud and cheer, not allowing any final remarks from anyone else showed me WHY I am a Hillary Clinton supporter. She is the REAL voice of America. It's not about getting the Toyota Center full of supporters to deliver eloquent speeches with bits and pieces taken from others. It's about being out there on the trail and seeing what is going on, what people are feeling, and knowing that we need someone that cares and shows compassion more than we need motivational speaking. Both of these comments from her, at different ends of the spectrum, defined what it means to cast a vote for Hillary Clinton.

Now, it's time for the discouraging aspects. First off, let's start with CNN. I get so sick and tired of their pointed and leading questions that they pose to Clinton and then present Obama with questions that are nothing of the like. I will give an exception to Campbell Brown who did hit him with a zinger about his stance back in 2003 compared to now. But, it's nothing like the constant fire they throw at Hillary.

Another thing that bothers me is how he's able to rebuttle almost every thing she has to say, but when he throws a dagger her way, she's expected to take it. For example, the heated discussion on Health Care and reforming it. They go to a commercial to keep Clinton from giving her retaliation to what Obama asserts. And when they come back, instead of keeping the conversation going, they try and change the topic. I give kudos to Hillary for not taking it and still getting her point out there. However, Barack still gets the last comment in. And Health Care was just one time when it happened. It happened far more than just that one issue.

Thirdly, the partisan and biased thoughts of the people they continuously ask opinions of on CNN. Before the debate even starts, Lou Dobbs (who I give credit to for trying to maintain some decency and impartiality) is talking with James Zogby. Zogby, who they show is an "Obama Supporter," is talking about how Michigan and Florida will remain stripped because it's their fault. And then references in Michigan how Democrats voted for Romney so that McCain wouldn't win, seeming as a statement that the results weren't an accurate tally of Democrats. Of course, he wasn't asked about the GOP (or recruitment of GOP voters) voting for Obama to ensure that Clinton would not get the nod and how that wasn't a fair representation of Democrats.

Another example that bothers me is in the "pre-game" show again the Latino representative they have on there. His biased and negative remarks towards "the Clinton's" and how no Latino should trust them should not be broadcast right before a debate, especially when there are so many Latino voters coming up in the Texas primary and there isn't another Latino there to defend Clinton. It's disturbing how biased that CNN is against Hillary Clinton and one reason that I'm disgusted with their network in this primary season.

And the last thing that disturbs me that I will touch on is how Obama is clearly trying to paint the "we're the same candidate, but I'm more enjoyable" picture. He continuously aligns himself with Hillary as to convince voters that a vote for Obama is a vote for her. So many times I heard him say that he agrees with her on the issues. And when she would present a contrast, outside of Health Care, he'd come around to align himself. I am sick of how he presents himself and always coming off as a follower rather than a leader. This behavior is not that of a Commander In Chief, but the behavior of a puppet. And it disgusts me how many people follow his rhetoric and mistake his positions as that of his own rather than following the lead of the stronger candidate.

Tonight just reaffirms me even more why I am in favor of Hillary Clinton. I'm tired of the public rallying around someone that is just being pulled by strings. But I'm not tired of someone that stands up for what they believe in and has a proven history of accomplishments and public service. I'm tired of Barack Obama. I'm not tired of Hillary Clinton.

I apologize for the length of the post. I had a lot to say about the debate. I look forward to reading more of your thoughts and any responses you have to mine. I'm going to start a new thread for the debate as well. Check that out. :-)

100% correct. It's a pleasure to read and ever so true. The bias of CNN is beyond disgusting and apart from this debate, I have boycotted them for more than a weekk now. Please post your contribution at the CNN blog - they may delete it after moderation but some people will get to see it in the meantime! It's worthy reading the article below too to see how CNN reconstructed the outcome of this debate to suit their commonly known agenda!

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/02/22/schneider-clinton-likely-did-little-to-blunt-obamas-momentum/

I have also started a topic related to making complaints to CNN:

http://www.hillaryclintonforum.net/discussion/showthread.php?t=286

[skc1976]

Murray,

Thanks for taking the time to read a very long post from me. :-) I appreciate it.

I'd love to post it, but not sure where to post it on their site. Is there a specific link for the actual debate rather than bits and pieces of it? But, you're right. They will neglect it, I'm sure. I've posted a lot that has never made it through. I guess I'm not the blind and ignorant supporter that they desire to post.

[CGP]

See below for another tremendously inspiring review of Hillary's debate with Obama tonight. Again sourced from a contributor to Taylor Marsh's blog (http://www.taylormarsh.com):

---------------------------------

Well well well, it would seem that HRC did what she needed to do and without doing it in the harsh attack style so many commentators/pundits said she needed to do because of how bleak things look for her at the moment, and instead did it in a manner consistent with Obama's message of positive politics, now how is that for irony? One of the things I have found most remarkable about her campaign over the past couple of months is that she has been walking the walk of Obama's talk while he has not, and perhaps this was finally when that became too hard for people to ignore. I must admit I loved the Xerox line, and that closing was pitch perfect, and I have to wonder whether Obama's constant rudeness in things like his writing during her closing when there was clearly no need to do so except as a means to try and make it seem like what she was saying wasn't important enough for him to pay attention to that he has displayed at the various debates reinforced the subconscious impression of his pettiness towards his competitors again in contrast to his uplifting messaging/theme/basis of his candidacy.

I do not know whether this was a true change moment with her closing, but it certainly has the potential to be so, and if nothing else the fact that she has been taking the pounding that she has in both the Obama wins of the past two weeks as well as the media hammering her repeatedly to boot and yet could deliver such a closer with her heart clearly on display showing this to be truly genuine (unlike so much of her competitor's best lines/moments as it turns out) shows a strength pf personality, character and integrity not easily dismissed. It also shows that for all that people say she isn't a positive optimistic politician that the truth is the opposite, for only such a person/politician could have done what she has done with that closer after everything she has faced, and I can't see how that doesn't work to her advantage.

As for Obama, the last thing he should be doing is trying to claim she also plagiarizes because as others have already noted it is only he that this is truly a major problem for, both in terms of the degree of offence being far greater from him as well as how much more it goes to the central reasoning of his candidacy than it does hers. After all hers is based on her issues/principles/objectives with the power of the Presidency in terms of execution while his is based on inspiration and being the cheerleader/inspirer in chief, and I have to wonder once people really start thinking about that whether they want another GWB leading primarily by the power of his words (as Jon Stewart mocked him for in the past) type President instead of a workhorse type President, especially given the major messes and challenges facing whomever wins the general election this year.

I also think the national polls have to be really worrying the Obama campaign given all his successes because the so called big mo is not showing up there, and given the strong of victories and favourable media he has had throughout the past few weeks with only recently things starting to turn on him media wise this cannot be a trend he wants to be seeing. So having her do this well in the debate tonight without his being able to undercut it must really have them worried, especially if they are acting as desperate as they clearly are in trying to claim she is a plagiarizer too given how much that obviously hurts his candidacy to even being discussed (the idea that he can talk about it against her without it also rebounding back on him after the last several days is laughable, even with his preferential media treatment) especially given she doesn't have that history whereas his record shows his repeated and large scale examples. In this media age he is not going to be able to hide this or simply edit after the fact and have it taken as gospel, not now.

Well, have a good night all, and just keep in mind that what you saw tonight should give you hope that things are not lost yet, indeed are far less close to lost than both the Obama campaign and the MSM want you to think. After all, attitude/mindset is at least half of winning any battle/victory, so do not fall for that psychological warfare trickery, keep the faith with HRC because as you saw again tonight she is clearly keeping the faith with her supporters, candidacy, and America.

(Scotian | Homepage (http://saundrie.blogspot.com/)| 02.22.2008 - 02:14 am)

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[CGP]

Murray,

Thanks for taking the time to read a very long post from me. :-) I appreciate it.

I'd love to post it, but not sure where to post it on their site. Is there a specific link for the actual debate rather than bits and pieces of it? But, you're right. They will neglect it, I'm sure. I've posted a lot that has never made it through. I guess I'm not the blind and ignorant supporter that they desire to post.

You know, I probably woudn't bother as they will delete it anyway! Mine was deleted as it contained statements against CNN. They are big on censorship.

[skc1976]

See below for another tremendously inspiring review of Hillary's debate with Obama tonight. Again sourced from a contributor to Taylor Marsh's blog (http://www.taylormarsh.com):

---------------------------------

Well well well, it would seem that HRC did what she needed to do and without doing it in the harsh attack style so many commentators/pundits said she needed to do because of how bleak things look for her at the moment, and instead did it in a manner consistent with Obama's message of positive politics, now how is that for irony? One of the things I have found most remarkable about her campaign over the past couple of months is that she has been walking the walk of Obama's talk while he has not, and perhaps this was finally when that became too hard for people to ignore. I must admit I loved the Xerox line, and that closing was pitch perfect, and I have to wonder whether Obama's constant rudeness in things like his writing during her closing when there was clearly no need to do so except as a means to try and make it seem like what she was saying wasn't important enough for him to pay attention to that he has displayed at the various debates reinforced the subconscious impression of his pettiness towards his competitors again in contrast to his uplifting messaging/theme/basis of his candidacy.

I do not know whether this was a true change moment with her closing, but it certainly has the potential to be so, and if nothing else the fact that she has been taking the pounding that she has in both the Obama wins of the past two weeks as well as the media hammering her repeatedly to boot and yet could deliver such a closer with her heart clearly on display showing this to be truly genuine (unlike so much of her competitor's best lines/moments as it turns out) shows a strength pf personality, character and integrity not easily dismissed. It also shows that for all that people say she isn't a positive optimistic politician that the truth is the opposite, for only such a person/politician could have done what she has done with that closer after everything she has faced, and I can't see how that doesn't work to her advantage.

As for Obama, the last thing he should be doing is trying to claim she also plagiarizes because as others have already noted it is only he that this is truly a major problem for, both in terms of the degree of offence being far greater from him as well as how much more it goes to the central reasoning of his candidacy than it does hers. After all hers is based on her issues/principles/objectives with the power of the Presidency in terms of execution while his is based on inspiration and being the cheerleader/inspirer in chief, and I have to wonder once people really start thinking about that whether they want another GWB leading primarily by the power of his words (as Jon Stewart mocked him for in the past) type President instead of a workhorse type President, especially given the major messes and challenges facing whomever wins the general election this year.

I also think the national polls have to be really worrying the Obama campaign given all his successes because the so called big mo is not showing up there, and given the strong of victories and favourable media he has had throughout the past few weeks with only recently things starting to turn on him media wise this cannot be a trend he wants to be seeing. So having her do this well in the debate tonight without his being able to undercut it must really have them worried, especially if they are acting as desperate as they clearly are in trying to claim she is a plagiarizer too given how much that obviously hurts his candidacy to even being discussed (the idea that he can talk about it against her without it also rebounding back on him after the last several days is laughable, even with his preferential media treatment) especially given she doesn't have that history whereas his record shows his repeated and large scale examples. In this media age he is not going to be able to hide this or simply edit after the fact and have it taken as gospel, not now.

Well, have a good night all, and just keep in mind that what you saw tonight should give you hope that things are not lost yet, indeed are far less close to lost than both the Obama campaign and the MSM want you to think. After all, attitude/mindset is at least half of winning any battle/victory, so do not fall for that psychological warfare trickery, keep the faith with HRC because as you saw again tonight she is clearly keeping the faith with her supporters, candidacy, and America.

(Scotian | Homepage (http://saundrie.blogspot.com/)| 02.22.2008 - 02:14 am)

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I had it in my debate notes and never touched on the fact of his writing throughout the debate, not only at the end, but whenever she was presenting legitimate differences. I'm sure that his stances and "solutions" (and I use the term VERY loosely for him) will change to reflect those notes and try to draw even more similar to him. But yes, it was evident that he wrote during the times she was at her best. Another showing of his dismissive attitude towards her. I can only hope that American's noticed this too.

And, on a humorous note, did anyone see him "cleaning out" his ear while she was talking? And his expression of getting caught. It's lighthearted, but funny too! A friend that was over for the debate party caught that and commented.

Thanks for posting this. It's great to see more views on the debate. Always encouraging when people give thoughts on Hillary in a positive light.

[skc1976]

You know, I probably woudn't bother as they will delete it anyway! Mine was deleted as it contained statements against CNN. They are big on censorship.

I wonder if Tipper Gore has a hand in CNN then. LOL Kidding

Seriously, it's sad how the media censors things worse than Wal-Mart does in their CD section. If anyone speaks out in a logical manner against them, they dismiss it and make sure it doesn't get shown. The joy of American Media. They are no better than the foreign media they criticize!

[Valencia]

I loved the Xerox too. Lack of originality. That will stay on people's mind. Know when he called her silly. That was so stupid from him. Because MO, his wife is the one who makes tha most silly comments. OMG!!! I canimagine her as a First Lady. I want change, but for good.

[CGP]

Another showing of his dismissive attitude towards her. I can only hope that American's noticed this too.

One of the qualities I find most alienating and unattractive about BO is his complete unwillingness to acknowledge anything good that Hillary Clinton has ever done. His inability to show any humility in this regard, and any recognition of her previous political and public life successes, is testimony to how insecure he really is. His dismissiveness of her previous attempts to change the health care system in the 1990s was laughable - once he has tried to achieve some kind of institutional change at this level of government, maybe then he can criticize, but until such time he should keep his mouth shut about things he's not qualified to comment on. She should have thrown that right back at him!

[CGP]

Great blog article reviewing Hillary's closing statement in the Texas Debate:

http://anglachelg.blogspot.com/2008/02/foundations.html

[CGP]

Thankfully Hillary responded to those ridiculous media reports that her closing statement last night was a kind of departure speech & restated her ongoing fight for the democratic nomination:

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/22/us/politics/22cnd-campaign.html?_r=1&hp&oref=slogin

[CGP]

ABC News reveiw of the debate. Incorporates analysis from a wide range of other news outlets:

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/TheNote/story?id=3105288&page=1