POLL (Round 1 of Voting): In the future, the forum may undergo a name change. Do you have any suggestions?

[CGP]

In thinking up suggestions, consider these plans:

- to open the forum up to a wider base of participants, including those that support the Democratic Party, those who support the Republican Party, and those who support neither...so regardless of who wins on Tuesday, supporters of both sides will be encouraged to participate in discussions

- a focus on bipartisan communication rather than extreme adherence to one side or the other

Some possibilities for a new name:

Bipartisan Sanctuary
www.BipartisanSanctuary.com

Bipartisan Central
www.BipartisanCentral.com

Midpoint Politics
www.MidpointPolitics.com

If a name change takes place, there will be an explicit notice that the forum was "formerly known as www.hillaryclintonforum.net" and there would be special reference to Hillary as being the original inspiration for the founding of this forum...

[kathleen]

Love the idea and direction. I'm partial to the bipartisan sanctuary or central. Both are good.

kudo's to Muzza! :D You made my day.

[cynthia2]

Politics in the Middle
Centrists United
No Divide
Across the Aisle Politics
Right of Left Left of Right
The Main Aisle


Just brainstorming.

[JustMom]

I have come to like this place and the people here. I am a very socially conservative woman. After the election, would I still be welcome? Would there still be room for a voice like mine?

Cheryl
who is not in the middle but likes patriots regardless of where they "live"

[CGP]

I have come to like this place and the people here. I am a very socially conservative woman. After the election, would I still be welcome? Would there still be room for a voice like mine?

Cheryl
who is not in the middle but likes patriots regardless of where they "live"

The idea is to provide a space where people of many different voices can post, including conservatives, and including Obama supporters.

Restricting participation to a narrow range of people is not helpful long-term. The more people who participate, the more constructive the debates will be. Yes, that may lead to a big increase in disagreements, but that's politics.

[ggreen]

Rational Politics?

Some definitions of "rational"

-Consistent with or based on or using reason; "rational behavior"; "a process of rational inference"; "rational thought"
-Intellectual: of or associated with or requiring the use of the mind; "intellectual problems"; "the triumph of the rational over the animal side of man"
-Characterized by truth or logic; (no comparative or superlative)
-Product features and price that allow comparison. Emphasis might be dependability, convenience, price, and savings associated with use.
-Using reason or logic in thinking out a problem. (Rationality, rationalism)
_

[JustMom]

The idea is to provide a space where people of many different voices can post, including conservatives, and including Obama supporters.

Restricting participation to a narrow range of people is not helpful long-term. The more people who participate, the more constructive the debates will be. Yes, that may lead to a big increase in disagreements, but that's politics.

I like that. Thank you. American Voice? or Americans Speak? (for a name, I mean)

[awayfrmitall]

I like:

Midpoint Politics
www.MidpointPolitics.com

[CGP]

Poll added with the 3 initial options.

[ZY123]

Poll added with the 3 initial options.

Oh boo....I want to vote for two of them! =P (What can I say I'm a Libra I can't decide!)

[Ikasu]

CentralPolitik?
MiddleAmerica?

I'm bad with names.. sorry!

[wulf12]

all good suggestions

maybe bipartisan-sanity.com:)

[LucyTN]

I like:

Midpoint Politics
www.MidpointPolitics.comMe too. I was just going to say that.

[seawave]

Muzza

You have put so much time and effort into this forum. I think one idea may be Muzza and Friends Political Forum. What ever name this forum takes, I know you will always be fair to all who log on.

[Pepper]

I voted MidpointPolitics:)

[Lodi]

Politics in the Middle
Centrists United
No Divide
Across the Aisle Politics
Right of Left Left of Right
The Main Aisle


Just brainstorming.

I like "NoDivide," but BipartisanSanctuary is my favorite. It (and BipartisanCentral) immediately identify the forum focus.

[Aria]

In thinking up suggestions, consider these plans:

- to open the forum up to a wider base of participants, including those that support the Democratic Party, those who support the Republican Party, and those who support neither...so regardless of who wins on Tuesday, supporters of both sides will be encouraged to participate in discussions

- a focus on bipartisan communication rather than extreme adherence to one side or the other

Some possibilities for a new name:

Bipartisan Sanctuary - www.BipartisanSanctuary.com

Bipartisan Central - www.BipartisanCentral.com

Midpoint Politics - www.MidpointPolitics.com
...

I like the plan, and would vote for Bipartisan Central. It sounds like what it would be - a "home" on the net for bipartisan discussion.

[kathleen]

I have come to like this place and the people here. I am a very socially conservative woman. After the election, would I still be welcome? Would there still be room for a voice like mine?

Cheryl
who is not in the middle but likes patriots regardless of where they "live"

And that's what it is all about. Nobody is going to have everything in common with everyone all the time. But civil discourse should be expected regardless. Muzza has given us all that place. I've come to value your voice and opinions, though I'm definately centrist to centrist left. (just a wee bit)

The idea is to continue civil discourse and exchange ideas. Even when we agree to disagree. And there will be those times just as there ARE those times at present. Not just with people to the right of me or left of me, as I've had moments of disagreement with members of my own party who are center left like myself. It happens. We come from all different backrounds and have different perspectives stemming from different experiences. No two are alike, even from the same family.

The conservatives on this site have been a pleasure to meet. Maybe the country can learn a lesson from all of us at HCF and work together for the good of the America no matter what party we come from.

Murray did mention that he wants to open the forum to all. That includes you. I am in love with that idea. This has been a great place of refuge in this political storm. A lighthouse of sorts.

[Amy Dugan]

Putting People First

[Lodi]

Oh boo....I want to vote for two of them! =P (What can I say I'm a Libra I can't decide!)

It takes decades of practice! :D;)

Signed,

Ms. October Fifth, the Elder ;)

[Wyoming Dem]

I like the plan, and would vote for Bipartisan Central. It sounds like what it would be - a "home" on the net for bipartisan discussion.

I also like Bi-Partisan Central- Hope For America. I hope we maintain the same standards of respect, LGBT friendly, all religions, etc.
It IS possible to have civil discussions about varying points of view. I understand that things can get heated on occassion but the mods are usually right on top of it and making the combatants take a time out (short suspension) and apologizing to all is a GREAT system. For as many members as we have and the HUGE differences some of us have, this has been the most respectful and harmonious site anywhere. Murray, you know I love you and I know you will choose what you think is best.

[Lodi]

The idea is to provide a space where people of many different voices can post, including conservatives, and including Obama supporters.

Restricting participation to a narrow range of people is not helpful long-term. The more people who participate, the more constructive the debates will be. Yes, that may lead to a big increase in disagreements, but that's politics.

I applaud your broadmindedness, but I hope for two things:

**that we'll still be a no-discrimination zone

**and that we'll focus foremost on topics that everyone can agree on (root out corruption, waste, etc.)

[ZY123]

I think the bipartisan votes will be split between central and sanctuary....

[CGP]

**that we'll still be a no-discrimination zone



That goes without saying! ;)

[Meg]

I've said all I need to say before... but Midpoint Politics is catchy.:D

[kathleen]

I think the bipartisan votes will be split between central and sanctuary....

Yup. I liked both equally. Since I had to pick between the two, I picked bipartisan...? I forgot! :eek:

[ILBlue]

Don't care , just don't go away !!!!!!!!!:)

[buffaloboy]

I'd like to find a way to get "respectful" in the name - as in, you have to be respectful of the other posters and their opinions, or get the hell out of here.

It is SO hard to develop a board that does not devolve into a shouting match between extremists, or just an echo chamber that has been taken over by one side or the other. In its initial incarnation, this board had a unifying theme, which was support for Hillary Clinton, which later turned into opposition to Obama, which is how I ended up here. But it has had a unifying theme throughout its existence.

Anyway, I like all the suggestions offered so far, so other than a general thumbs up on the whole idea, I'm not going to be much help in narrowing it down.

[Dendy]

www.MidpointPolitics.com for me:D

[scully931]

For as many members as we have and the HUGE differences some of us have, this has been the most respectful and harmonious site anywhere.


Being that so much of our site (well, your site :D) is dedicated to rooting out things the media won't tell us about Obama, I'm a little curious and concerned as to how this site is going to remain harmonious and a nice place to come if a lot of Obama supporters join. For instance, on any given thread here, Obama supporters would have flooded it with obsenities and horrible remarks within seconds, rendering it unreadable. We've experienced them on other message boards, which is why many of us come here. :confused:

[Avalon]

I really like Bipartisan Sanctuary, because that is exactly what this forum has been for all of us!:D All three names ae really good Muzza.:)

[Still-a-Republican]

awomen4potus.net

Yep that coming from a non sexist Alpha male, I admire leadership regardless of gender! ;)

[deniseds]

I've said all I need to say before... but Midpoint Politics is catchy.:D

I agree and a good reminder that we need to fight to keep it that way.

[Lodi]

Being that so much of our site (well, your site :D) is dedicated to rooting out things the media won't tell us about Obama, I'm a little curious and concerned as to how this site is going to remain harmonious and a nice place to come if a lot of Obama supporters join. We've experienced them on other message boards, which is why many of us come here. :confused:

I tend to agree. Obama supporters have their collective heads in the sand, sometimes, as in the case of one of my cousins, by choice! :eek: If they don't come to see that ObamaCORN cheated many of us out of our votes and Hillary out of the nomination, how will we all be able to meet at any midpoint. Doesn't acknowledgment of reality have to precede any meeting?

[CGP]

Being that so much of our site (well, your site :D) is dedicated to rooting out things the media won't tell us about Obama, I'm a little curious and concerned as to how this site is going to remain harmonious and a nice place to come if a lot of Obama supporters join. For instance, on any given thread here, Obama supporters would have flooded it with obsenities and horrible remarks within seconds, rendering it unreadable. We've experienced them on other message boards, which is why many of us come here. :confused:

Not all Obama supporters are like that. There are many Hillary supporters who previously posted here who no longer do simply because they didn't feel welcome anymore as they were willing to vote for Obama. Such people shouldn't be shut out.

[CGP]

I tend to agree. Obama supporters have their collective heads in the sand, sometimes, as in the case of one of my cousins, by choice! :eek: If they don't come to see that ObamaCORN cheated many of us out of our votes and Hillary out of the nomination, how will we all be able to meet at any midpoint. Doesn't acknowledgment of reality have to precede any meeting?

"Obama supporters" are a diverse group. I doubt they would inundate the forum. But having some present will add some spice to the debates. If everyone agrees with each other all the time, there is no real debate - just lots of "stamping".

[Power of Palin]

How about the "Socialist Watchdog.com"?

[Pepper]

"Obama supporters" are a diverse group. I doubt they would inundate the forum. But having some present will add some spice to the debates. If everyone agrees with each other all the time, there is no real debate - just lots of "stamping".

I have to agree. And lol at the "stamping". Yep.

[CGP]

The idea is to have a forum/website which falls somewhere in the middle between Democratic Underground (Left) and Free Republic (Right), but which does not exclude those who support the left or who support the right. Yes, an all-inclusive fantasy!

[Aria]

Actually, I've changed my mind. Perhaps you would change my vote, Muzza, from Bipartisan Central to Midpoint Politics? Thanks! I think Midpoint Politics has a more positive ring to it and infers a goal can be met and accomplished, whereas bipartisan is kind of an overworked, tired word by now. Midpoint Politics rolls right off the tongue and is neat and clear. (And no, I'm not voting for "who's" ahead, or perceived to win in the poll ;)).

[Isis46]

I liked MidPoint Politics the best; bipartisan is overused, I think. But I am happy to know there is a future, no matter the outcome in 2 days.

Thanks, Muzza and all the other fine HCF friends who have kept me sane for the past 2 months.

[santafek]

I too like MidPoint Politics. It implies we can discuss and come to an agreement, in my mind. That we can arrive at a middle way. As an aside, the Episcopal Church has had a long tradition of "via media," the middle way. This implies that we can have differing opinions, and that we have to make room for and be open to differing voices too, yet still proceed ahead.

And thank you, dear Muzza, for your generosity also in asking for a name for a new direction.

[Latina4Hillary]

Partisan Central is my choice but I hope a reference to Hillary will be incorporated into the new banner. In my heart we will always be the HCF.

[buffaloboy]

Not all Obama supporters are like that. There are many Hillary supporters who previously posted here who no longer do simply because they didn't feel welcome anymore as they were willing to vote for Obama. Such people shouldn't be shut out.

I agree - reasonable people that support Obama should not be shut out. Now, my own personal opinion is that it is not possible to be reasonable and support Obama at the same time, but that's just me.

But if you can find any reasonable Obama supporters who want to post here, I will give them a respectful hearing. One of the first criteria for reasonableness should be: you have to disagree with Obama (and McCain for that matter) on at least one thing each. You have to also agree that Obama (or McCain or Palin or Clinton) is just a politician, who may or may not have the country's best interests at heart, or who may simply driven by personal ambition.

All of the Obama supporters I've run into have had a striking resemblance to Ben Affleck's send-up of Keith Olbermann, only Affleck-Olbermann was far more respectful of disagreement than most Obamabots that I have met.

[thebword]

I like Bipartisan Central or BC for short. Before Clinton (Hillary's Presidency) is what I'll be thinking.

[NBM]

I like the concept!

All those names are good. Some more:

Middle Ground Politics

Post-Partisan America

Beyond Party Politics

[twobyfour]

I think all three may be registered and 2 forwarded to the final address, because it may turn out to be a sanctuary (hopefully not).

Muzza, just in the case things go awry, which I don't believe they would... you've probably read my comment on one of the threads... that I could set up a server in Canada that would host the site. Please keep that on you file.

[Wyoming Dem]

Being that so much of our site (well, your site :D) is dedicated to rooting out things the media won't tell us about Obama, I'm a little curious and concerned as to how this site is going to remain harmonious and a nice place to come if a lot of Obama supporters join. For instance, on any given thread here, Obama supporters would have flooded it with obsenities and horrible remarks within seconds, rendering it unreadable. We've experienced them on other message boards, which is why many of us come here. :confused:

I do agree with you and I guess the mods will be working overtime to root out the whackos. I will have a very hard time dealing with Obama supporters because I think they were willing to overlook so much just to defeat the Republicans and I was a Dem for 40 years so I can say that. It really did become PARTY over country and that is a tough one for me to tolerate. Doesn't mean I won't try. And I understand completely as I have posted on other sites and it just got gross, obscene and hateful (and it takes a lot to "obscene" or "gross" me.) Murray may have to increase the "Forum Police" (I just got a mental picture of Optix in a cop suit carrying a nitestick..maybe I am the whacko.) I guess there will be lots to work out and some growing pains I am sure. We can do this.

[Aria]

I think the bipartisan votes will be split between central and sanctuary....

Just to let you know that this didn't go unnoticed!:D

[calPuma]

I hope a reference to Hillary will be incorporated into the new banner. In my heart we will always be the HCF.

I hope for this too. Because she has been our inspiration.

[kathleen]

I think the bipartisan votes will be split between central and sanctuary....

And I think we've just been out voted on both bipartisans. LOL.

[TexasFlower]

Oh Lord. I'm so tired of screaming nasty Obots. This forum truly felt like a sanctuary from that stuff. :o
sigh.

[Brooke]

I like Bipartisan Central

[mjoynaples]

I tend to agree. Obama supporters have their collective heads in the sand, sometimes, as in the case of one of my cousins, by choice! :eek: If they don't come to see that ObamaCORN cheated many of us out of our votes and Hillary out of the nomination, how will we all be able to meet at any midpoint. Doesn't acknowledgment of reality have to precede any meeting?


help me to understand how this will work out well... that is why i picked bipartisanpoliticsanctuary.com this place has been that and more for ... helped me process the very difficult HRC days... and deal with the lies and cheating etc that looms large in the BHO campaign ... we were in a sanctuary because the troll/bot alert is so keen , we did not have to endure the negativity here for the most part...

[MinnforHill]

Yes, Democrats for Truth and Common Decency.

[ZY123]

Just to let you know that this didn't go unnoticed!:D

hehehe...revote! Or we should have strategized first. :p

[B positive]

I prefer HillaryClintonForum :( ... but I voted for MidPointPolitics:o

[CGP]

I prefer HillaryClintonForum :( ... but I voted for MidPointPolitics:o

HillaryClintonForum would retain a prominent place in any new forum banner! (if the name changes)

[CGP]

Maybe "bipartisan" is a bit too formal.

"Midpoint Politics" is a fairly self-explanatory - somewhere in the middle, not extreme in either direction.

[ZY123]

Maybe "bipartisan" is a bit too formal.

"Midpoint Politics" is a fairly self-explanatory - somewhere in the middle, not extreme in either direction.

too bad Sanctuary can't be worked in somehow...or that there isn't a better word than bipartisan.

[CGP]

too bad Sanctuary can't be worked in somehow...or that there isn't a better word than bipartisan.

It may cease to be a "sanctuary" if membership is opened up more broadly! ;)

[Calico]

I voted for MidpointPolitics. :)

[ZY123]

Being that so much of our site (well, your site :D) is dedicated to rooting out things the media won't tell us about Obama, I'm a little curious and concerned as to how this site is going to remain harmonious and a nice place to come if a lot of Obama supporters join. For instance, on any given thread here, Obama supporters would have flooded it with obsenities and horrible remarks within seconds, rendering it unreadable. We've experienced them on other message boards, which is why many of us come here. :confused:

I don't group all Obama supporters into one category like that and if we're going to accept all views well it needs to be ALL views. I know a lot of forum members here who have friends and relatives that voted for Obama...I highly doubt they are all nutcases or freaks...and I don't think all of the horrible remarks on the baord have been from Obama supporters or are all Obama supporters bad people per se. (And no I didn't vote Obama!)

[iami]

I kind of like "right ofl eft and left of right" (is it possible to do that sort of mb name without the spaces and still make it readable). It expresses the best of the present forum and would attract newbies regardless of the election outcome (and/or it's consequences).

I do want to say that the solace I have found in this board in terms of like-minded bi-partisans has caused my hope for the future of this country to survive. May we prevail.

[TexasFlower]

But I thought this forum was working for Hillary's run in 2012?

How would that work - if Obama people are on here doing their astroturfing and playing psychological games, like this year?

In the event that Hillary runs again, would this be a safe forum? And I like what someone earlier said about Obama's supporters don't even acknowledge the fraud involved in the caucuses, ACORN, etc ,etc ?

[CGP]

But I thought this forum was working for Hillary's run in 2012?


That might be a project for a later date if/when it becomes relevant. There is no guarantee she would even run again, so it may not be productive to spend 4 years focusing on something that may not happen.

[joeysky18]

Oh Lord. I'm so tired of screaming nasty Obots. This forum truly felt like a sanctuary from that stuff. :o
sigh.


I think the golden rule of the forum will still remain that we don't take any bullshit from any poster regardless of their political views.

Any argument needs to be back up with facts. We don't listen to false claims or accusations.

[CGP]

I think the golden rule of the forum will still remain that we don't take any bullshit from any poster regardless of their political views.

Any argument needs to be back up with facts. We don't listen to false claims or accusations.

Yes, and that applies to those who support any candidate/party.

[CGP]

11/9/41

[iami]

I think that should Hillary decide to run, you won't find a lot of by then "4-yr. Pub veterans" deserting you. We have a dog in this fight and the Pubs aren't showing any signs of being up to the challenge of presenting us with a viable candidate should Obama win (bite my tongue). Trust me on this, they will NEVER nominate Sarah (that's farther down the pike).

That being said, should Hillary decide NOT to run, I think we would be a powerful force in determining the nominees of BOTH parties.

Now, if McCain wins, I think this forum still has an important role to play over the next four years. We are the voice of the people that brought about that win (well, ok, you PUMAs are) and you WILL be heard in an McCain administration. We Pubs will see to it.

[JJ4Hillary]

I vote for midpointpolitics.com.:)

[ZY123]

It may cease to be a "sanctuary" if membership is opened up more broadly! ;)

good point....I just like the word...it's like some underground club. :cool:

[Meg]

good point....I just like the word...it's like some underground club. :cool:


LMAO:cool:;)

[TexasFlower]

oh and I just realized the total irrationality of my own question. If Hillary runs again in 2012 that would mean Obama lost - which would make the Obots less of a problem (hopefully :rolleyes:) as far as their astroturfing.

But I get that - I guess it doesn't make sense to keep this nothing but Hillary 24/7 for the next 4 years. lol

[B positive]

HillaryClintonForum would retain a prominent place in any new forum banner! (if the name changes)

:):):):):) small victories - PUMA is not just for '08 - it's until the DNP is disinfected

[Irony!]

Muzza,

First of all, thank you for this forum.

We've all come together for the sake of America in spite of our party affiliation. That's a beautiful thing! So, whatever you name it, I will support you (for whatever it's worth.)

[jdona]

Why can't we keep the Puma in a new name, maybe PumaPolitics?

[VotingHillary]

The idea is to provide a space where people of many different voices can post, including conservatives, and including Obama supporters.

Restricting participation to a narrow range of people is not helpful long-term. The more people who participate, the more constructive the debates will be. Yes, that may lead to a big increase in disagreements, but that's politics.

This is your forum, Muzza, and I will respect whatever name you decide to call it. My lone question to you though is this. Will you continue with the same forum guidelines? I would hate for the decorum to be reduced to that of most other political sites.

[eyedoc333]

I voted for #2, but still like HCF as a sentimental favorite.

[CGP]

My lone question to you though is this. Will you continue with the same forum guidelines?

Absolutely!

[CGP]

16/12/46

[12counts]

I voted for #2, but still like HCF as a sentimental favorite.

I too prefer HCF, but I'm outnumbered here, so I defer to everyone else.

My favorite thing about this site was that it was a safe haven from Obama's most vicious supporters. I really don't think you need them to have a substantive and robust debate. In fact, I think this forum has proven quite the opposite.

[peachick]

I am just so thrilled that we are still going to have a forum with everybody still together! I like " Beyond Party Politics" This forum has brought so many people together from the left and right to a place where we can share and have respect for each other. This is exactly what this country needs. Common ground with respect between people that share their political ideas. :) :D :cool:

[ellyp]

I like the suggestions but I have to say I will miss the PUMA name so it is sad that it isn't in anything. I had fantasies of the PUMA party becoming a party of its own with its mascot being a cougar. Love that!! 'Course, I should point out that I am a conservative Republican... :D I'd be tempted to join a PUMA party with y'all because I like how feisty everyone here is!

[RE:]

good point....I just like the word...it's like some underground club. :cool:

LMAO:cool:;)

Oooohhh...Like This?? Well, Kinda...:eek:

http://clublaunderground.com/Club%20LA%20Underground%20Index%20Page.jpg

[tommy]

voted for MidpointPolitics.com, catchy domain name and easy to remember.

[Doris T.]

I voted above, but I'd like to add:

Sanctuary for Political Freedom


I have to say that I might have a difficult time with Obama supporters. I don't know if I could be impartial about anything to do with Obama. These last few months have had me so upset. I can't stand the fraud, lack of integrity, etc. etc.

I don't know how to come back from the way HRC was treated by Obama and the democratic party. And, if Obama were elected, I doubt that I will be able to think of anything good about his presidency after that. It is the worst kind of election ever and I hope it will never happen again!!!

I would like to say "Thank You," for having this forum to come to so I could voice my opinion and feel safe in doing so.

IMO, I don't think HRC will run in 2012. She couldn't foresee the Media bias or her own parties' discrimination against her, just like most of us weren't able to see what transpired. I wouldn't want to put myself in debt again or deal with a democratic party who snubbed their noses at the best candidate for the position if I were in HRC's shoes. She is way too qualified to subject herself to such ill-treatment ever again.

I am hoping for McCain to win and, just maybe, he might appoint HRC as a Supreme Court Judge. It would be so fitting to her and what a payoff for all of us who supported her candidacy for president.

[cynthia2]

I like "NoDivide," but BipartisanSanctuary is my favorite. It (and BipartisanCentral) immediately identify the forum focus.

This is a good point. I voted for Midpoint politics but now I'm thinking maybe having the Bipartisan word in there is important, if we're working with those three choices than either of the Bipartisan one's I would go with.

[patrioticlady]

I voted for Bipartisan Sanctuary, to me that brings to mind a safe place to be, a welcoming place, all are welcome and accepted.

[cynthia2]

I have to say that I might have a difficult time with Obama supporters. I don't know if I could be impartial about anything to do with Obama. These last few months have had me so upset. I can't stand the fraud, lack of integrity, etc. etc.


I have to say, I agree with you on this!!! I am hopeful that at some point I can get beyond this, but right this second, hanging out with real live Kool Aid drinkers just sounds very difficult. :mad:

[Peppermint Patty]

In thinking up suggestions, consider these plans:

- to open the forum up to a wider base of participants, including those that support the Democratic Party, those who support the Republican Party, and those who support neither...so regardless of who wins on Tuesday, supporters of both sides will be encouraged to participate in discussions

- a focus on bipartisan communication rather than extreme adherence to one side or the other

Some possibilities for a new name:

Bipartisan Sanctuary
www.BipartisanSanctuary.com

Bipartisan Central
www.BipartisanCentral.com

Midpoint Politics
www.MidpointPolitics.com

If a name change takes place, there will be an explicit notice that the forum was "formerly known as www.hillaryclintonforum.net" and there would be special reference to Hillary as being the original inspiration for the founding of this forum...

I kind of like Bipartisan Central but I would love it if on November 5th it could be:

WeKickedObamasAss.net :D:p:D

[Kbentleyis]

Muzza, I relly think you should use your name like "Murray's Midpoint Politics." I like the fact that your name would be recognized. Let's go to Murray's!

[Suzan]

I voted for MidPoint Politics, but I also like these two by NBM:

Post-Partisan America

Beyond Party Politics

[EsmeraldaB]

I kind of like Bipartisan Central but I would love it if on November 5th it could be:

WeKickedObamasAss.net :D:p:D

I'M VOTING FOR THAT ONE!!!! ROTFLMAO :D :D :D

[NewHamster]

I hate CHANGE. I want it to stay the HCF.:(

[Aria]

IMO, I don't think HRC will run in 2012...She is way too qualified to subject herself to such ill-treatment ever again...I am hoping for McCain to win and, just maybe, he might appoint HRC as a Supreme Court Judge. It would be so fitting to her and what a payoff for all of us who supported her candidacy for president.[/B]

Hillary has said unequivocably that she is not interested in a Supreme Court position. I heard her answer to this, and she sounded pretty certain to me. Frankly, I think she needs to be around people more, and I'd hate to lose her to the SC even though she would be wonderful there.

[marcelmarcel]

Can we wait?
Take a deep breath after election day?

[Frances]

I don't know, but tired of Bi!

[Aria]

I kind of like Bipartisan Central but I would love it if on November 5th it could be:

WeKickedObamasAss.net :D:p:D

Hillary-ous! :D:):D

[CGP]

19/18/54

[twobyfour]

Can we wait?
Take a deep breath after election day?

A good point, but the poll can be open and suggestion can be made. No harm in being a tad proactive.

[geneo]

this site,and the people here,are a force to be reckoned with. you all are amazing,for a group as diverse as this, to put aside our differences and come together for a common good.who da thunk it?:p im proud of you all! you prove it can be done.

[Doris T.]

....HillaryforChange08

Thanks for the info, I didn't realize she had stated that.

I think she would be a strong voice wherever she is, but I believe she could benefit all Americans as our president, just don't know if it would ever happen at this point unless the democratic party can be changed by our voting. We need better representation thats for sure.

[Andy_Licious]

I voted for Bipartisan Sanctuary, however, I have some suggestions:


The Magnificent Middle

The Creative Center

:)

[evolin]

I don't see large groups of BOTs wanting to join with this forum. If we become a powerful political force, I can see them dropping by to spy, though.
For me this has been a "hurtful political season" We missed a good chance of having Hillary, the best candidate for president this time.
I worked hard for her and contributed more than I could really afford.
We must not delude ourselves about things and need to recognize that Hillary has moved on. She has chosen her own path now and has moved beyond our reach to choose her.
So we need to choose a new path and move on too.
I have been deeply wounded by the sequence of events this time. Sure the political system has always had corruptness, but this time it was so much worse for me. I thought it was OUR time as intelligent women to have someone represent us. The mistreatment of Hillary is a sore that won't heal quickly.
Moving on to a new type forum that broadens our perspectives, input and ideas, will help us slowly heal. If we are able somehow to affect change, that will be the best medicine.
Keeping the same old format will merely rub salt into my wounds. I would not stay here under those circumstances. I need to stop dwelling in the past and move on. I am sure Hillary would approve. I voted for #3.

[cinder]

I voted for midpointpolitics. It's been nice to be welcomed here, and be part of a common cause.

I just want to say thank you for helping me keep my sanity the past couple of months. :)

[CGP]

20/18/59

[EsmeraldaB]

We must not delude ourselves about things and need to recognize that Hillary has moved on. She has chosen her own path now and has moved beyond our reach to choose her.


That remains to be seen. This campaign has been all about stifling the truth. I prefer to watch and wait, and see what we find out after McCain wins. Then the real answers will start to come out. I'm all for Hillary in 2012.

Andy, I like The Magnificent Middle. :D

[IndyPUMA]

I like Mindpoint

Thanks for all you have done and I look forward to contributing. In case those domains are taken I'll put on my thinking cap.

[evolin]

That remains to be seen. This campaign has been all about stifling the truth. I prefer to watch and wait, and see what we find out after McCain wins. Then the real answers will start to come out. I'm all for Hillary in 2012.

Andy, I like The Magnificent Middle. :D
Well don't get me wrong - if Hillary runs in 12, I will support her.
In the mean time we need to move on beyond this election and use the forum to help change things.
As of this time Hillary has moved on and we need to move on too.

[CGP]

Well don't get me wrong - if Hillary runs in 12, I will support her.
In the mean time we need to move on beyond this election and use the forum to help change things.
As of this time Hillary has moved on and we need to move on too.

I feel the same way.

[CGP]

21/18/64

[Jen the Michigander]

I voted for Bipartisan Central. And I agree with those who want to see Hillary's photo in the banner.

[Ikasu]

21/19/65

Looks like MidpointPolitics is the winner

[xfiles]

I think most of us here do not like or respect Obama and to have HIS supporters mingle here is insulting. I don't want to give him any legitimacy.

I would rather see this forum be a watchdog over the dem Congress & Obama (gag) if it comes to his being president.

We could possibly have a separate section for the other more centrist and more open discussion but I do not care to hear what anyone who supports Obama has to say because he will be a fraud as president if elected.

For the time being could you leave it as is and see where things go?

I personally would love to have a place to come *itch about Obama!

[CGP]

I think most of us here do not like or respect Obama and to have HIS supporters mingle here is insulting. I don't want to give him any legitimacy.

I would rather see this forum be a watchdog over the dem Congress & Obama (gag) if it comes to his being president.

We could possibly have a separate section for the other more centrist and more open discussion but I do not care to hear what anyone who supports Obama has to say because he will be a fraud as president if elected.

For the time being could you leave it as is and see where things go?

I personally would love to have a place to come *itch about Obama!

The future direction of this forum WILL include some Obama supporters. Understandably, however, some people may not be able to tolerate that. But that's what is going to happen if the forum is opened up to a broader audience & base. Once Plan B is over, it's over. I know & understand this will be difficult for some to face, but a forum such as this goes through many phases/identies and change is up ahead (again).

[samkm]

MidPointPolitics sounds really good.

[xfiles]

I guess I'm confused as to why Obama supporters would be welcomed here since we know Obama is going to destroy this country. If he isn't elected, that would be different I suppose but it's your forum. What would be the etiquitte guidelines for debate and proving to his supporters what he is doing and how it will affect things (mostly negatively probably, etc.)? In other words can there be significant debates as long as there is no foul language, etc.?

The future direction of this forum WILL include some Obama supporters. Understandably, however, some people may not be able to tolerate that. But that's what is going to happen if the forum is opened up to a broader audience & base. Once Plan B is over, it's over. I know & understand this will be difficult for some to face, but a forum such as this goes through many phases/identies and change is up ahead (again).

[CGP]

What would be the etiquitte guidelines for debate and proving to his supporters what he is doing and how it will affect things (mostly negatively probably, etc.)? In other words can there be significant debates as long as there is no foul language, etc.?

The guidelines will be the same as they are now. If people are reasonable & not offensive, they should be allowed to post. In reference to the past, it is absolutely the case that people have had their accounts suspended solely for expressing support for Obama, and not because they posted offensively in any way. That has to stop. The idea behind the future direction of the forum is to allow people of all political persuasians to post here, regardless of who they support. If a person disagrees with the dominant opinion, that should not be grounds for "suspension". If a person is abusive & offensive in their postings, that is another matter and is absolutely grounds for "suspension".

[tommy]

I'm just hoping that Obama supporters won't be taking over this nice community in the future if that was the case. I've been to many neutral website (political wise) that has been taking over by bots. It is hard to stand on the same line with them.

[CGP]

I'm just hoping that Obama supporters won't be taking over this nice community in the future if that was the case. I've been to many neutral website (political wise) that has been taking over by bots. It is hard to stand on the same line as them.

No. It's easy to restrict membership should such an invasion be planned!

Registration can always be turned on/off depending on what is going on...

[Debi/CA]

I certainly don't want to spoil the spirit of nonpartisanship, but what if our fears about BO come true? For example, we may want to get the word out when any radical policies are passed by a no-checks or balances congress.

[WV4Hillary]

Middle of the Road Politics

She fought for us...now we fight for her.
www.middleoftheroad.com

[Tsabarit]

demopublican.com

[HRC4Me]

Country First

nuff said.

Let's leave the partisan talking points behind and start thinking of this country as a whole, rather than whats good for my party.

[CountryFirst]

I have to add my two cents.

I voted for BiPartisan Sanctuary ...

I like MidPoint Politics ...

But for pure catchiness, how about:

Purple State

Unfortunately, there is already a blog by that name.

So, I checked out MidPoint and there is a blog by that name, too.

http://midpointpolitics.blogspot.com/

It's hard to find something completely original ... It seems like the board members like MidPoint Politics best.

What about:

Centrist Nation

[CGP]

So, I checked out MidPoint and there is a blog by that name, too.

http://midpointpolitics.blogspot.com/

Yes, I discovered that when I went to register the name at www.blogger.com!

The main thing is grabbing the domain name/s for the title which has been done.

[CGP]

23/20/71

[velocet]

Ok, so there's some resistance to the idea of posting with BHO supporters; I understand that whole sentiment.

Just be prepared for republitrolls as well.



velocet

[CGP]

Just be prepared for republitrolls as well.




Are "republitrolls" hardcore Repubs who aren't friendly?!?

[Mrsawd]

Sorry have to pass on this vote !
I guess you guys can pick !
I will be happy with what ever you all pick !

[Tsabarit]

I have to add my two cents.

I voted for BiPartisan Sanctuary ...

I like MidPoint Politics ...

But for pure catchiness, how about:

Purple State

Unfortunately, there is already a blog by that name.

So, I checked out MidPoint and there is a blog by that name, too.

http://midpointpolitics.blogspot.com/

It's hard to find something completely original ... It seems like the board members like MidPoint Politics best.

What about:

Centrist Nation

i like purple state alot!

[Annie]

The idea is to provide a space where people of many different voices can post, including conservatives, and including Obama supporters.

Restricting participation to a narrow range of people is not helpful long-term. The more people who participate, the more constructive the debates will be. Yes, that may lead to a big increase in disagreements, but that's politics.

Love it!

America middle ground
Real Democracy
American Patriots
Mavericks on both sides

[hobbitt]

The future direction of this forum WILL include some Obama supporters. Understandably, however, some people may not be able to tolerate that. But that's what is going to happen if the forum is opened up to a broader audience & base.


Once the primaries were over, and the focus of the forum switched to defeating Obama, I was able, barely, to grit my teeth and ignore much of the posts being made by newer members.

I was insulted by the "liberal scum" comments; I was impatient with the Rush-as-god or Morris Toe Sucker as a Genius comments. I was enraged at the "Hillary is polarizing" b.s.

And I was getting weary of the misunderstanding of some: I did not become a Republican, I did not turn conservative overnight. I just wanted to defeat Obama. And I stuck with it.

This forum has been a life-saver (and a marriage-saver). I was able to take out my Obama frustrations here, I was energized by the efforts to disseminate the truth. I was heartened by the company of like-minded individuals. And I appreciate the costs, both the real cost and the huge efforts put forth by Murray and the Mods. And this forum being here, I did not have to throw anything at my tv. For all of that I am grateful.

But if I have to read pro-Obama crud, I will bid you all a fond adieu.

[CGP]

Once the primaries were over, and the focus of the forum switched to defeating Obama, I was able, barely, to grit my teeth and ignore much of the posts being made by newer members.

I was insulted by the "liberal scum" comments; I was impatient with the Rush-as-god or Morris Toe Sucker as a Genius comments. I was enraged at the "Hillary is polarizing" b.s.

And I was getting weary of the misunderstanding of some: I did not become a Republican, I did not turn conservative overnight. I just wanted to defeat Obama. And I stuck with it.

This forum has been a life-saver (and a marriage-saver). I was able to take out my Obama frustrations here, I was energized by the efforts to disseminate the truth. I was heartened by the company of like-minded individuals. And I appreciate the costs, both the real cost and the huge efforts put forth by Murray and the Mods. And this forum being here, I did not have to throw anything at my tv. For all of that I am grateful.

But if I have to read pro-Obama crud, I will bid you all a fond adieu.

Noted! ;)

Any ideas/thoughts/feelings about the prospect of a name change?

[CGP]

23/22/72

[Ijane]

This forum has been a life-saver (and a marriage-saver). I was able to take out my Obama frustrations here, I was energized by the efforts to disseminate the truth. I was heartened by the company of like-minded individuals. And I appreciate the costs, both the real cost and the huge efforts put forth by Murray and the Mods. And this forum being here, I did not have to throw anything at my tv. For all of that I am grateful.

But if I have to read pro-Obama crud, I will bid you all a fond adieu.

If obama should steal this election the only reason for an obot posting here would be for the purpose of "re-educating"

[LadyVT]

I like FAIR REFLECTION

[scully931]

*snip*

But if I have to read pro-Obama crud, I will bid you all a fond adieu.

I will as well. Certainly it is Muzza's forum and that's that so I'm not trying to be difficult. But, I need a place to go where I don't have to listen to pro-Obama rants. The man is slimy, untrustworthy and has manipulated this election. If it was just a difference in politics, I would have no problem discussing differences. I'm generally quite open-minded to other's points of view. However, if Obama pulls this off, I need a place to go without pro-Obama discussion. I get enough of that in 'real life.' :(

[velocet]

Are "republitrolls" hardcore Repubs who aren't friendly?!?


Yes. I've seen a few organized trolling communities. Theirs is something else.

Their origin is traceable to the Limbaugh notion that there is no such thing as a moderate. Any person claiming to be a moderate is, in their view, purely intellectually dishonest. Republitrolls cannot abide such heresy: first comes an attempt to convert a moderate into the lock-step routine. Resistance yields ridicule from them. Of course anyone left of center is purely a target.

At times over the years and on different boards I've seen and laughed at their antics. Other times I've gotten into it with some because their narrow view of conservatism begs for attack. Flamewars and sometimes subsequent bannings and deletions ensue.

If "GeeDub2K" shows his slimy self and gang of cretins here, expect fireworks.

It should also go without saying that they'll do all in their power to make sure this isn't a gay friendly forum.



velocet

[Bad Kitty]

Somewhere in the middle is definintely a great idea Muzza.

[ZY123]

In reference to the past, it is absolutely the case that people have had their accounts suspended solely for expressing support for Obama, and not because they posted offensively in any way. That has to stop.

Absolutely....all views should be welcome...especially those of the founding members (and yes that includes someone who voted Obama). I fail to see why that is even a discussion topic after Tuesday - I hope we will not be rehashing the GE ad hominem.

If we're still going to be hating on Obama...that just doesn't sound too interesting to me....I'm over that.

[Bad Kitty]

Absolutely....all views should be welcome...especially those of the founding members (and yes that includes someone who voted Obama...I fail to see why that is even a discussion topic after Tuesday).

If we're still going to be hating on Obama...that just doesn't sound too interesting to me....I'm over that.

As long as it doesn't cause too much drama. I would like for the board to stay as drama free as possible.

[ZY123]

As long as it doesn't cause too much drama. I would like for the board to stay as drama free as possible.

true...but still I want some peeps back! :)

Plus...logically it has to be done...unless we want to be MidPoint Excluding the Left Politics. ;-)~ I'm not saying bring on the extremists...there's a big difference between an extremist and an O voter.

[Bad Kitty]

true...but still I want some peeps back! :)

Plus...logically it has to be done...unless we want to be MidPoint except for the Left Politics. ;-)~

Except for the extreme nuts. They can stay on their respective sites IMHO.

[ZY123]

Except for the extreme nuts. They can stay on their respective sites IMHO.

of course...that goes for both extremes...it is MID...;)

[Bad Kitty]

of course...that goes for both extremes...it is MID...;)

Yeah. I meant both. Anytime anyone is extreme, they are bound to be a nut case and cause issues here in an otherwise peaceful place.

[NSTYLE77]

This has been such a great place to get away from the nasty trolls. They have enough websites they can go to where they can be vile!

[Bad Kitty]

This has been such a great place to get away from the nasty trolls. They have enough websites they can go to where they can be vile!

I'll stamp that 1,000 times.

[ZY123]

OK now I have a question...do people still want discuss Obama after Tuesday? I so have no interest in that....regardless of who wins.

[Bad Kitty]

OK now I have a question...do people still want discuss Obama after Tuesday? I so have no interest in that....regardless of who wins.

To me it depends on what's going on. If the election is over and there is a clear winner than nothing else is newsworthy about him, I'm assuming. But if cheating is happening and the election is still going on for a couple of days, I feel that all topics are fair game.

[ZY123]

To me it depends on what's going on. If the election is over and there is a clear winner than nothing else is newsworthy about him, I'm assuming. But if cheating is happening and the election is still going on for a couple of days, I feel that all topics are fair game.

That's why I think the temporary break is a great idea - I'm glad that's happening.

[Debi/CA]

OK now I have a question...do people still want discuss Obama after Tuesday? I so have no interest in that....regardless of who wins.
If BO wins, don't we want to keep an eye on any radical laws proposed in Congress, which he might sign?

[Bad Kitty]

If BO wins, don't we want to keep an eye on any radical laws proposed in Congress, which he might sign?

I didn't think about that Debi but that is very true.

[Bad Kitty]

That's why I think the temporary break is a great idea - I'm glad that's happening.

Yes. I think we will all need a temporary break.

[Doris T.]

Based on what has transpired throughout the primary and now the general election, I still have so many questions about Obama's past and his associations.

Obama knows what he is doing and, while it's claimed he has shown poor judgment, I think he is happy with his choices to date.

Obama is a walking time bomb. I have a hard time believing that any discussions about him could be middle of the road. I know I don't want to understand him since that would be like trying to understand Ayers.

Obama's agenda is beyond my comprehension. All his life he has been working toward this event......to become president. Apparently, he has a lot of help along the way in order for him to get this far. It isn't a fluke.

We need only look to Farrahkan's powers that be and the Nation of Islam. Who would call anyone the messiah!?!? Yet, Louis X, now known as Louis Farrahkan did. IMO, Farrahkan is a silent partner of Obama.

It is interesting to note here that Louis Farrahkan has allegedly had a hand in the assassination of Malcolm X because he left the Nation of Islam to start his own ministry and organization. Black on Black crime.....dispose of anyone who won't agree with their tactics or messages even a leader such as Malcolm X who was admired by so many African-Americans.

Sorry.....my point is that I would have difficulty in talking nice about Obama.

[Bad Kitty]

Sorry.....my point is that I would have difficulty in talking nice about Obama.

I think alot of us would.

[Johnf]

I didn't think about that Debi but that is very true.

Exactly, very true.

[Johnf]

That's why I think the temporary break is a great idea - I'm glad that's happening.

There is also the issue of his citizenship, and files all over America concerning Obama that are currently being held under lock and key. No matter what happens, this isn't over yet. He'd like to think it is, he'd like to think we'd all forget all about everything, and stay quiet, not discuss him, not raise any issues.

If McCain wins, still raising these issues
If for some reason McCain doesn't win, and the Obama camp have cheated, still raising these issues.
How can we allow someone to do the things he's done, raise them as we have and suddenly forget them all after November 4 because the election happens to be over. That is Obama's plan, hoping we will. That's how he's always gotten away with things - hoping people forget, and everyone remains silent. He's not expecting anything to be questioned after the election.

[blueskygal]

I like America Voices - or Democracy Workshop

[PCFS1]

To me this will always be the "HILLARY CLINTON FORUM" many of us have been here through the tough battles that Hillary had fought. We cried with her, we cheered with her and we stood by her. I and many of us love this board. I have seen posters from all over the world comment here. Some shared news information that maybe others never saw or heard. I hope to continue to be a part of this board both in support of it and to contribute to it.
I so hope that this forum will keep Hillary front and center always. Hillary is the main reason we are all here together.


"Keep going..don’t stop. If you hear the dogs barking, keep going. If you hear the gun shots..keep going.” Hillary quoting Harriet Tubman

[Johnf]

The future direction of this forum WILL include some Obama supporters. Understandably, however, some people may not be able to tolerate that. But that's what is going to happen if the forum is opened up to a broader audience & base. Once Plan B is over, it's over. I know & understand this will be difficult for some to face, but a forum such as this goes through many phases/identies and change is up ahead (again).

First, thank you for this forum. It's been encouraging, it's helped people understand what is right, it allowed people to fight back against what is wrong, the suppression, lies, fraud and corruption. It gave everyone a voice. It encouraged respect, values and integrity.

The two biggest changers in this election were Hillary, then Palin. These two women did and are making history. They toughed it out, they took risks, they spoke out against what was happening that they felt was wrong. They had and have the future of America in mind.

I'd like to see Hillary's picture on the banner of this forum. She was the reason this forum got together. We got together over not just policies, and candidates, we got togetther over the integrity, values, morals, respect, identity and actions of the candidates, parties and media. We fought a battle - an important battle.


The fact that many of us moved over to Republican side to fight what Obama, DNC and media were doing, saying, is significant. It said we put country first, party second. It was at that time we started to see the media, DNC and Obama camp attack Palin the same way they attacked Hillary. The Obama camp, while crying race, did more to set women back years in development. I have an elder mother in law, and aunts, who like to keep women down. Any time their daughters, neices or women speak up, look for a level playing field or respect, they work to keep them down. Every time Obama and his supporters, including the media would attack Hillary, then Palin, it seemed to make them happy. They feel a woman's place is in the home, kitchen, out of politics; that it is a man's job. They feel women should be seen and not heard. It is no surprise that these women lived abusive lives and want to thrust that abuse onto others. They thrive on women taking a back seat, their goal is to keep it that way and it didn't seem to matter to them what Obama did, bad, wrong, without ethics or integrity, the fact that women would be taken down, put in their place, kept down was their goal.

In his campaign, Obama, the DNC and media did a great disservice to women. They abused and allowed abuse against women, all so their candidate could get in. They played the race card, party unity, and made a mockery of Hillary's attire, words to keep Hillary quiet. They bullied, intimidated, abused to keep women down. It was a case of divide and conquer. This can and is seen in the work place. This is not what I want to or will ever support. Equality and respect is just that. There are many single parents raising their children, who need assistance and respect. This election set women back many years and it will take years for them to recover from these attacks. It hurts them in the workforce and in the homes. Without equality, fairness and respect, you're going to have troubled children, broken families, problems in the workforce. This needs to change.

Whatever this forum needs to move onto, the fundamentals need to be equality for all, and the damage that was done to women in the election and how that must be changed moving forward, otherwise, it's tolerating and accepting abuse.

Hillary gave up the fight because her money ran out against the money machine, fraud and abuse of the Obama camp and she was most likely threatened, intimidated and bullied into keeping quiet and supporting Obama if she wanted to see those bills paid off. It was not Hillary's choice to move on; she wanted to fight the fight against what was wrong she was forced into this position. However the older I get the more I realize things are not always as they seem.

[PCFS1]

Quote...........
Hillary gave up the fight because her money ran out against the money machine and abuse of the Obama camp and she was most likely threatened, intimidated and bullied into keeping quiet and supporting Obama if she wanted to see those bills paid off. It was not Hillary's choice to move on; she wanted to fight the fight against what was wrong, however the older I get the more I realize things are not always as they seem.
I believe with all my heart that she had no choice. She would have a real hard time in the Senate and any future this wonderful lady has in mind. JMO So please let us keep her front and center on this forum. After all,she is our hero.

[ShyFire]

I chose Midpoint.

IF O steals this thing- there must be a concerted effort to watch-dog and document his failures- and there will be plenty, if he takes office.

I doubt the DNC will 'allow' Hillary to run against him in '12 if he is elected- but, no matter who is chosen to dethrone him- whether it is another Dem or a new repub- I am going to be there!

IF McCain wins- we'll need to keep an eye on him, too. We, the people, need to make sure that the politicians we elect are doing what they say they are going to do! And hold them accountable.

JM2c. =)

GO MAC! Let's win this thing.. and get our country back on track!

[NanCi1214]

What about:

The Vital Center

The Rational Center

Add these:

The Integral Center

The Logical Center

Requirements: Support of Hillary Clinton/Sarah Palin to ensure fair treatment of women in politics plus other requirements as developed. We need to avoid the extremes of both right and left as they already have plenty of outlets and partisans.

[NewHamster]

But if I have to read pro-Obama crud, I will bid you all a fond adieu.

I will never, ever, EVER forgive the BOTS for how they treated Hillary (and Bill) and her supporters. I need a place away from them. I would like a place that focuses on truth and respect and fair elections.

[ggreen]

If obama should steal this election the only reason for an obot posting here would be for the purpose of "re-educating"

I've wondered about that. I would hate to see the forum become part of the propaganda machine. I'm not talking about very overt methods, but rather that slow and methodical shift in perceptions. I suppose we're vigilant enough to prevent this, but I do think we need to consider it and be aware that it's possible.
_

[PCFS1]

I've wondered about that. I would hate to see the forum become part of the propaganda machine. I'm not talking about very overt methods, but rather that slow and methodical shift in perceptions. I suppose we're vigilant enough to prevent this, but I do think we need to consider it and be aware that it's possible.
_My thoughts also. Good point and should be taken in consideration. Especially the slow and methodical shift in perceptions.

[Tea toaD]

Once the primaries were over, and the focus of the forum switched to defeating Obama, I was able, barely, to grit my teeth and ignore much of the posts being made by newer members.

I was insulted by the "liberal scum" comments; I was impatient with the Rush-as-god or Morris Toe Sucker as a Genius comments. I was enraged at the "Hillary is polarizing" b.s.

And I was getting weary of the misunderstanding of some: I did not become a Republican, I did not turn conservative overnight. I just wanted to defeat Obama. And I stuck with it.

This forum has been a life-saver (and a marriage-saver). I was able to take out my Obama frustrations here, I was energized by the efforts to disseminate the truth. I was heartened by the company of like-minded individuals. And I appreciate the costs, both the real cost and the huge efforts put forth by Murray and the Mods. And this forum being here, I did not have to throw anything at my tv. For all of that I am grateful.

But if I have to read pro-Obama crud, I will bid you all a fond adieu.

I won't be fond of them either but you can always put people you don't care to hear from on ignore:rolleyes: If they get too obnoxious and messiahish that is an option:rolleyes: As far as not wanting to talk about Obama, if I see any thread with a title that doesn't appeal to me, I don't open it:p If I do open it and it's not to my liking I close it and move on to one more interesting;)

[foxyladi]

I agree and a good reminder that we need to fight to keep it that way.

me too..will our accounts ,stay as is.???or will we have to get new everything,will our posting numbers stay??

[foxyladi]

I think alot of us would.

there will be NO REASON,,to even menton bo after tomorrow..
by by bo...

[MaryKay]

What About Checks and Balances -

A website for Americans fighting for what Washington Won't Do.

If Obama wins, I'd be happy to write a weekly blog on the site called "Obama's Broken Campaign Promises." If McCain wins, then I will write a blog called "Maverick Check," to ensure that "The Mavericks" stay bipartisan.

[ModerateRepublican]

I like midpoint.

I think bipartisan is a "dirty word"

Obama is "bipartisan" even though he never worked across the aisle.

Every single politicians say they are bipartisan. The word is dead to me.

Now midpoint. Hmm. I like it. It's new. I visual describes the political spectrum and the people in the middle.

[mrkalbo]

Why not PUMA? this have gained recognition already.
Maybe
www.imapuma.com
www.imapuma4ever.com
www.pumasanctuary.com

[TeejDee]

I like Hilary Clinton Forum the best.....

[Ijane]

I like Hilary Clinton Forum the best.....

I agree.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bad Kitty View Post
Except for the extreme nuts. They can stay on their respective sites IMHO.
of course...that goes for both extremes...it is MID...

We are extremists or at least we have been for the last 9 months. Why does that change once the election is over? I'm not voting for McCain because I'm sore about Hillary not being the Democratic nominee. I'm voting for McCain because I believe with all my heart that a monster wants to destroy America only to recreate it into something very un-American. I think Barack Obama has evil intent and to rearrange the forum into something different negates everything we stood for. It just proves Howard Dean's theory that in time we'll all submit.

[FlaDem]

I think if BO gets in our energy needs to shift from preventing him from becoming president to watching over his presidency. With BO as president and a Democratic Congress checks and balance will be thrown out the window. We need to become watchdogs.

While the purpose of this Forum would become broader and more inclusive I feel that the undercurrent in all political discussion could be one of keeping an eye on what BO and the Congress are up to.

That said, I like Midpoint, but I also like the purple; watchdog and PUMA aspects. What about Purple Watchdog or Purple Puma?

[jdona]

I posted this before, and I'm glad to see mrkalbo pick up on it as well. We are all Pumas here, and I think we need a title that clearly identifies that. We are part of the Puma Nation, so we should carry that over in the new name. Whatever you decide on, it should have puma somewhere either in the title or the tagline.

[joeysky18]

Midpointpolitic for me.

[Doris T.]

IMO, it may not be possible at this time for midpoint discussions. I think JohnF and others have made some very valid points.

We aren't politicians. HRC must do what she has to do to survive in the political arena, but our voices have been used to point out injustices, downright fraud, lying, cheating, etc.

We are HRC supporters first. Obama only copied HRC's opinions, issues and agenda to make it his own so that whomever didn't like HRC or a woman as president would choose him instead.

What Obama and his campaign and Obamabots have done is create chaos and threaten the very being of American voters. We have been shocked and overwhelmed to say the least by this man's tactics. If he is elected, it will be a very, very long 4 years and I can't see where most of us can develop a middle of the road attitude towards his presidency.

Obama still has his civil service (can't think of the name) in motion so these Obamabots will be in people's faces and who can have a give and take discussion with such rhetoric.

Hopefully, McCain will win and, if so, it will still be a long time before Obama settles his loss through the courts. He said he doesn't believe in coming in second and he will pull the race card and no doubt has prepared in advance for lawsuits, ads, conferences, TV appearances to tell everyone of the outrageous election, especially since the polls have had him winning throughout the last two or three months.

I can almost hear his voice saying, "how can it suddenly switch and it would tell any reasonable person that something went amiss if he had been winning prior to the election, and yet after all was said and done, he didn't win the presidency., etc. etc.

The more I think about it, the more I believe that I cannot be a party to Obama's presidency if he were elected. So, I know I could not contribute anything towards any of his actions. I would need to find a forum that will be working towards getting him out of office and behind bars...where I truly believe he belongs.

Every forum does evolve, but it really would take a very long time, IMO, if at all to be able to discuss Obama without cringing....he has done far too much damage, along with the DNC, the MSM, Obamabots, The Democratic Party. We have been robbed, trashed, hoodwinked by our party, and our vote didn't count.

As an older woman, I feel that this election has pushed us all back 40 years from all the progress made for womens' rights, civil rights, and the American voters' rights. So anyone who is younger and has felt the benefits of that progress will be hard-pressed to find repeated injustices, as they say history repeats itself.

[ImmaSlave4U]

I'd like to see the forum move back to its roots and become more moderate. After Obama got the nomination, this forum (thanks to the influx of Freepers) has taken an extreme right turn. And I'd like to see us become more balanced again.

I say keep it Hillary, too.

[scully931]

If BO wins, don't we want to keep an eye on any radical laws proposed in Congress, which he might sign?

That's what I'm thinking! I want a place to learn about these things. Certainly the news won't tell me! :eek:

[scully931]

I've wondered about that. I would hate to see the forum become part of the propaganda machine. I'm not talking about very overt methods, but rather that slow and methodical shift in perceptions. I suppose we're vigilant enough to prevent this, but I do think we need to consider it and be aware that it's possible.
_

Also a good point. Obama supporters will come here. While the loud obnoxious ones may get banned, this forum could easily be used by the more savvy components to slowly alter our perceptions. This is especially scary if Obama carries out a socialist agenda. Remember, this campaign has left very little unturned. It would not surprise me in the least if they sent people on here to convert us. Easy enough at the moment to say it won't happened, but over time... :(

[hillarymyhero]

Yes, almost all of us are not extremists in any way, we are the real deals. We are neither leftists or rightests. We're the real genuine people just like our Hero Hillary Clinton.

In my heart I still believe that Hillary will be our President some day(hmm 2012) or 2016....

And I also do believe that Chelsea Clinton will be our President 2020 or 2024............

[mrkalbo]

I posted this before, and I'm glad to see mrkalbo pick up on it as well. We are all Pumas here, and I think we need a title that clearly identifies that. We are part of the Puma Nation, so we should carry that over in the new name. Whatever you decide on, it should have puma somewhere either in the title or the tagline.

yes and I may add: www.pumanation.com

[JLB123]

Won't get fooled again.com

Country First.com

Former Democrats.com

[JLB123]

What About Checks and Balances -

A website for Americans fighting for what Washington Won't Do.

If Obama wins, I'd be happy to write a weekly blog on the site called "Obama's Broken Campaign Promises." If McCain wins, then I will write a blog called "Maverick Check," to ensure that "The Mavericks" stay bipartisan.



That's a good one.

[12counts]

If BO wins, don't we want to keep an eye on any radical laws proposed in Congress, which he might sign?

Yes, I would hope so. I would hope that we opposed Obama because we were actually opposed to his agenda. If so, we should continue as a watchdog group against that agenda.

I don't know if that can be done properly and honestly with Obama supporters here playing Jedi mind tricks. Look what happened to Taylor Marsh's site when she sold out. It's not pretty.

I like the idea of "ChecksandBalances.com: Doing the media's job, because they won't."

[Destiny]

I like Hilary Clinton Forum the best.....

Me too.

Thank you Murray for giving us a safe place to go without being harassed by Obama supporters. It was a real 'piece of mind' for me to find your site and share ideas and our thoughts with Hillary supporters.

We did 4 rallies for Hillary on the corner of Laurel Canyon and Ventura Blvd. in Los Angeles. The Obama supporters were so disgusting, angry and gross. We were mostly women and small children and the Obama supporters felt it was important to yell at us non-stop. They yelled (in front of my 7 and 9 year olds), "we want a bro, not a ho, c*nts, b*tches, wh*res, Hillary is a d*ke, go f*ck yourselves, you all are menopausal", and my favorite "go eat Hillary's p*ssy you lesbo d*kes" and we got the middle finger many, many times. Obama has the most unkind supporters.

I had to take my Hillary bumper sticker off my car because the Obama supporters were angrily flipping me off and trying to play 'chicken' with me and my children would be in the back seat in their car seats witnessing this horrible behavior. My children had already seen too much during our rallies and now they were begging me to remove my Hillary stickers, because they said they were scared.

At the beginning of the primaries, I was on Hillaryclinton.com (Hillary's site) and it was wonderful. They were quick to remove all pro-Obama and anti-Hillary comments (just like this site), it was a safe place to go.
The day that Hillary withdrew (June 7, 2008), Hillaryclinton.com became a nightmare. Like Mad Max. They started posting all anti-Hillary and Pro-Obama. I left and never went back. I came to this site and found the same 'safe place' that Hillary's site use to be. A couple of weeks later I got a long letter from a Hillary supporter sent to me from Connecticut. She said that they were trying to find all the supporters that were on Hillaryclinton.com and that she found me by our YouTube rallies and peoplesearch and she told me that we were all on a new site (started by a Hillaryclinton.com member) called Hillaryvillagers. When I went to the site it was like going home. People were so glad that I was found and remembered my posts and we since have found most of the original members. So, I know what it feels like to lose on-line (Hillary) friends and how wonderful it feels to be found.

I know I will not be able to continue if this site has the same fate as Hillary's site (by allowing Obama supporters), but I do hope that someone will start up a new 'Hillary only' site, like this, because Murray had the best Hillary site on the internet.

I'll miss all of you.


NO OBAMA - NEVER

[12counts]

Thank you Murray for giving us a safe place to go without being harassed by Obama supporters. It was a real 'piece of mind' for me to find your site and share ideas and our thoughts with Hillary supporters/

STAMP. Thanks, a thousand times thanks.

[Meg]

Absolutely....all views should be welcome...especially those of the founding members (and yes that includes someone who voted Obama). I fail to see why that is even a discussion topic after Tuesday - I hope we will not be rehashing the GE ad hominem.

If we're still going to be hating on Obama...that just doesn't sound too interesting to me....I'm over that.



**Stamp**

I, in all honesty, at this point could put up with Obama suppporters. No offense to our more conservative members or anything, but I've sat here and listened to your views for the better of 4 months. Obama supporters would not really affect this forums views too much aside from the fact they openly supported Obama. Other than that they share a lot of the same views on certain issues like many of us original members.

I'm with Talyn on this one, I will not be sticking around if this over-the-top anti-Obama crap continues.:rolleyes: I'VE hit my breaking point with it, and I've been annoyed by him since the primaries!

[CountryFirst]

yes and I may add: www.pumanation.com

I love PUMA Nation.

It suggests somewhat of an underground rebellion against the status quo.

I think it could attract people who aren't happy with Republican party politics, too.

And Obama supporters might be attracted as they come to view him as the TOOL that he is.

[Bad Kitty]

I love PUMA Nation.

It suggests somewhat of an underground rebellion against the status quo.

I think it could attract people who aren't happy with Republican party politics, too.

And Obama supporters might be attracted as they come to view him as the TOOL that he is.

I like that idea too!

[cindyb]

I like, "Country First" that may be taken already though.

[Donald]

I actually think changing the name of this forum is WRONG. I see no need to do so and believe that by changing the name it will forever change the purpose of this site...

Hillary Clinton earned our support and she earned the reason this forum exist. I think its a slap in the face to all we have endured to take Hillary out of that equation. I realize she would be given credit....but thats almost like this election itself...shove Hillary into the background while we go on to other things.

I think its a bad idea and think the site can and should survive and thrive as the Hillary Clinton Forum.

[PCFS1]

I actually think changing the name of this forum is WRONG. I see no need to do so and believe that by changing the name it will forever change the purpose of this site...

Hillary Clinton earned our support and she earned the reason this forum exist. I think its a slap in the face to all we have endured to take Hillary out of that equation. I realize she would be given credit....but thats almost like this election itself...shove Hillary into the background while we go on to other things.

I think its a bad idea and think the site can and should survive and thrive as the Hillary Clinton Forum.Yes I agree in honor of hillary. Please she earned it the hard way. Lets not change the forum name. God Bless Hillary Clinton.

[NewHamster]

I actually think changing the name of this forum is WRONG. I see no need to do so and believe that by changing the name it will forever change the purpose of this site...

Hillary Clinton earned our support and she earned the reason this forum exist. I think its a slap in the face to all we have endured to take Hillary out of that equation. I realize she would be given credit....but thats almost like this election itself...shove Hillary into the background while we go on to other things.

I think its a bad idea and think the site can and should survive and thrive as the Hillary Clinton Forum.

This post really hit home for me. I want Hillary to be our common thread..

[hillwillwin08]

I actually think changing the name of this forum is WRONG. I see no need to do so and believe that by changing the name it will forever change the purpose of this site...

Hillary Clinton earned our support and she earned the reason this forum exist. I think its a slap in the face to all we have endured to take Hillary out of that equation. I realize she would be given credit....but thats almost like this election itself...shove Hillary into the background while we go on to other things.

I think its a bad idea and think the site can and should survive and thrive as the Hillary Clinton Forum.

Agree

[Alessandro Machi]

I kind of think Fair Reflection was ground zero, however I think it is taken, as is Fair Reflection with a dash between the words.

[CT-Hilltopper]

I actually think changing the name of this forum is WRONG. I see no need to do so and believe that by changing the name it will forever change the purpose of this site...

Hillary Clinton earned our support and she earned the reason this forum exist. I think its a slap in the face to all we have endured to take Hillary out of that equation. I realize she would be given credit....but thats almost like this election itself...shove Hillary into the background while we go on to other things.

I think its a bad idea and think the site can and should survive and thrive as the Hillary Clinton Forum.

I agree wholeheartedly.

We are a group of people that love Hillary. She brought us here, and we are devoted to her. That's our common bond...the thread that holds all of us together...

[nycboy]

DEMOCRATUNITED.COM

Hi Murray, don't we already have this domain :) Lets take the party back, and give those DU suckers a better competition. But by having democratunited, we may not get enough republican friends. :(

[FlaDem]

Checksandbalances.com. is also good. It implies a watchdog purpose.

[Artists4Hillary]

Partisan Central is my choice but I hope a reference to Hillary will be incorporated into the new banner. In my heart we will always be the HCF.

This is how I feel too. I would like this forum to be recognized by it's original intent. This is what brought us together.

[jdona]

I like PumaNation.com too. Welcome to puma land!

[CGP]

**Stamp**

I, in all honesty, at this point could put up with Obama suppporters. No offense to our more conservative members or anything, but I've sat here and listened to your views for the better of 4 months. Obama supporters would not really affect this forums views too much aside from the fact they openly supported Obama. Other than that they share a lot of the same views on certain issues like many of us original members.

I'm with Talyn on this one, I will not be sticking around if this over-the-top anti-Obama crap continues.:rolleyes: I'VE hit my breaking point with it, and I've been annoyed by him since the primaries!

I hear ya & agree.

[Mrsawd]

The Unity effect have had has been awesome to this election !


The ups and downs we have shared together has helpped pull us through all this !


Hillarys Unity effect has what has gotten us all through this as a group !

[Agent 00½ FL]

Thank you Muzza and Mods. for everything. I like the "MP".

[CGP]

I actually think changing the name of this forum is WRONG. I see no need to do so and believe that by changing the name it will forever change the purpose of this site...

Hillary Clinton earned our support and she earned the reason this forum exist. I think its a slap in the face to all we have endured to take Hillary out of that equation. I realize she would be given credit....but thats almost like this election itself...shove Hillary into the background while we go on to other things.

I think its a bad idea and think the site can and should survive and thrive as the Hillary Clinton Forum.

Evolution is a natural part of life. Change occurs when the circumstances support it. The name change is not guaranteed - this thread is merely discussing the possibility. That said, I personally have some discomfort about using Hillary Clinton's name in the title of the forum when nowadays 90% of the discussion is not about her. And given she has publically supported Obama in a major way, the anti-Obama sentiments expressed here don't reflect accurately on her public position & her hope for the Democratic Party. As such, something has to give...

[CGP]

29/34/99

[CGP]

29/34/101

[woman4change]

I really like the idea of having debate. This place is awesome, but maybe it would be healthy to exchange thoughts and different views with others.

I know the forum would definitely need to be moderated heavily, cause I've seen some places get totally out of hand.

I voted for Bipartisan Central....just because I think people would Google that term more than the other, but whatever works ~ :)

[Hoosier]

I would like to see this forum continue with the main objective of cleaning house at the DNC.

[RachachaSharon]

Putting People First

. . . and putting Country first!

[LucyTN]

Evolution is a natural part of life. Change occurs when the circumstances support it. The name change is not guaranteed - this thread is merely discussing the possibility. That said, I personally have some discomfort about using Hillary Clinton's name in the title of the forum when nowadays 90% of the discussion is not about her. And given she has publically supported Obama in a major way, the anti-Obama sentiments expressed here don't reflect accurately on her public position & her hope for the Democratic Party. As such, something has to give...I like your reasoning. I hadn't thought of it that way but you're quite right. Hillary supports Obama, we don't. That's simple enough.

[Johnf]

Evolution is a natural part of life. Change occurs when the circumstances support it. The name change is not guaranteed - this thread is merely discussing the possibility. That said, I personally have some discomfort about using Hillary Clinton's name in the title of the forum when nowadays 90% of the discussion is not about her. And given she has publically supported Obama in a major way, the anti-Obama sentiments expressed here don't reflect accurately on her public position & her hope for the Democratic Party. As such, something has to give...

Hillary had no choice but to support him; she was millions in debt. He knew he was running her debt up, he knew she would end up owing him if he and the DNC could force her out, and because of that would end up having to support him in a major way. Politcally she could not jump parties, and the DNC would have gone after her had she done that.

Evolution is a natural part of life, I agree, and with that, I could never respect Obama for what he has done. I didn't support him when he fought against Hillary and abused the situation, and I certainly don't now. I believe in what I am standing up for, that is why I took up the cause.

You see, for me, this election has been about respect and integrity and standing up against abuse, as it has been about policies. This election has been biased, fraudulent and that is not something I will forget. I don't enjoy the media lying, as I didn't enjoy the bias, fraud that went on. That will never change no matter who wins this election. I understand what Hillary did and why she had to campaign for Obama, it doesn't mean I have to support Obama. I will most likely drop off from posting should Obama win. The reason being is very simple for me: I cannot support something I don't believe in, or I feel is disrespectful, abusive, or lacks integrity.

[Johnf]

I'd like to see the forum move back to its roots and become more moderate. After Obama got the nomination, this forum (thanks to the influx of Freepers) has taken an extreme right turn. And I'd like to see us become more balanced again.

I say keep it Hillary, too.


This forum has not changed much really. It has always been respectful. The complaints against Obama were as strong now as they were when Obama was attacking Hillary.

The times when it wasn't moderate is when the Obama supporters got on here and started attacking first Hillary, then Palin.

[Bad Kitty]

This forum has not changed much really. It has always been respectful. The complaints against Obama were as strong now as they were when Obama was attacking Hillary.

The times when it wasn't moderate is when the Obama supporters got on here and started attacking first Hillary, then Palin.

I agree with you John.

[ZY123]

**Stamp**

I, in all honesty, at this point could put up with Obama suppporters. No offense to our more conservative members or anything, but I've sat here and listened to your views for the better of 4 months. Obama supporters would not really affect this forums views too much aside from the fact they openly supported Obama. Other than that they share a lot of the same views on certain issues like many of us original members.

I'm with Talyn on this one, I will not be sticking around if this over-the-top anti-Obama crap continues.:rolleyes: I'VE hit my breaking point with it, and I've been annoyed by him since the primaries!

STAMP STAMP!!!

Seriously I'm over the hating on Obama.......I know nice and and decent people that voted for him...do I disagree with their decision? YES! but are they nutcases and the source of all evil? NO!

And remember that great group of people that we worked side by side with during the primaries...those dedicated Hillary supporters...the ones who disagreed and went and voted for Obama for whatever reason? Well I still think they're wonderful people and no I don't think they're freaks, **** disturbers or nutcases.

We either have to include all views or we can't be Mid anything.

[hillary4change]

MidPointPolitics for me!
I also like CommonGroundPolitics.

[Bill4Hill]

There is also the issue of his citizenship, and files all over America concerning Obama that are currently being held under lock and key. No matter what happens, this isn't over yet. He'd like to think it is, he'd like to think we'd all forget all about everything, and stay quiet, not discuss him, not raise any issues.

If McCain wins, still raising these issues
If for some reason McCain doesn't win, and the Obama camp have cheated, still raising these issues.
How can we allow someone to do the things he's done, raise them as we have and suddenly forget them all after November 4 because the election happens to be over. That is Obama's plan, hoping we will. That's how he's always gotten away with things - hoping people forget, and everyone remains silent. He's not expecting anything to be questioned after the election.

You make an insightful and compelling point. I'm with you.

[scully931]

There is also the issue of his citizenship, and files all over America concerning Obama that are currently being held under lock and key. No matter what happens, this isn't over yet. He'd like to think it is, he'd like to think we'd all forget all about everything, and stay quiet, not discuss him, not raise any issues.

If McCain wins, still raising these issues
If for some reason McCain doesn't win, and the Obama camp have cheated, still raising these issues.
How can we allow someone to do the things he's done, raise them as we have and suddenly forget them all after November 4 because the election happens to be over. That is Obama's plan, hoping we will. That's how he's always gotten away with things - hoping people forget, and everyone remains silent. He's not expecting anything to be questioned after the election.

I quite agree. I feel like some people think we should just lay down on November 4th no matter what happens. That's exactly what Obama is hoping for.

[12counts]

Seriously I'm over the hating on Obama.......I know nice and and decent people that voted for him...do I disagree with their decision? YES! but are they nutcases and the source of all evil? NO...We either have to include all views or we can't be Mid anything.

You make it sound like the "hating on Obama" was arbitrary. It has nothing to do with him being "evil." That's simplistic and glib.

I was under the impression that we opposed Obama because of his lack of character, race baiting, encouragement of corruption at the DNC, socialistic tax plan that and ideas on "spread the wealth around"/"radicalize the Constitution"/"redistribute wealth" policies, and lack of foreign policy experience that would invite "international crisis."

Correct me if I'm wrong, but what's going to be different on Wednesday morning except that American voters will have accepted or rejected these as the qualities they want in a President? Is Obama going to stop playing the race card? Is the DNC going to not be corrupt? Will we be okay with redistributing wealth? Will we suddenly agree with a foreign policy that puts the nation at risk?

If this forum simply opposed Obama for arbitrary, nonsensical, revenge minded reasons, then we need to know that so those of us who opposed him on principle can move on. If this forum opposed Obama for reasons of substance...well, those reasons will still be valid Wednesday morning -- win, lose, or draw.

I disagree that we should accept all views. Some views are untenable. You have to stand for something. We should continue to do so. What made this forum great is that we stood proudly for what (we thought) was right.

Or at least I thought that's what we were doing :(

[Johnf]

You make it sound like the "hating on Obama" was arbitrary. It has nothing to do with him being "evil." That's simplistic and glib.

I was under the impression that we opposed Obama because of his lack of character, race baiting, encouragement of corruption at the DNC, socialistic tax plan that and ideas on "spread the wealth around"/"radicalize the Constitution"/"redistribute wealth" policies, and lack of foreign policy experience that would invite "international crisis."

Correct me if I'm wrong, but what's going to be different on Wednesday morning except that American voters will have accepted or rejected these as the qualities they want in a President? Is Obama going to stop playing the race card? Is the DNC going to not be corrupt? Will we be okay with redistributing wealth? Will we suddenly agree with a foreign policy that puts the nation at risk?

If this forum simply opposed Obama for arbitrary, nonsensical, revenge minded reasons, then we need to know that so those of us who opposed him on principle can move on. If this forum opposed Obama for reasons of substance...well, those reasons will still be valid Wednesday morning -- win, lose, or draw.

I disagree that we should accept all views. Some views are untenable. You have to stand for something. We should continue to do so. What made this forum great is that we stood proudly for what (we thought) was right.

Or at least I thought that's what we were doing :(

Agree.

[CGP]

Please continue with this discussion. It's important.

[scully931]

You make it sound like the "hating on Obama" was arbitrary. It has nothing to do with him being "evil." That's simplistic and glib.

I was under the impression that we opposed Obama because of his lack of character, race baiting, encouragement of corruption at the DNC, socialistic tax plan that and ideas on "spread the wealth around"/"radicalize the Constitution"/"redistribute wealth" policies, and lack of foreign policy experience that would invite "international crisis."

Correct me if I'm wrong, but what's going to be different on Wednesday morning except that American voters will have accepted or rejected these as the qualities they want in a President? Is Obama going to stop playing the race card? Is the DNC going to not be corrupt? Will we be okay with redistributing wealth? Will we suddenly agree with a foreign policy that puts the nation at risk?

If this forum simply opposed Obama for arbitrary, nonsensical, revenge minded reasons, then we need to know that so those of us who opposed him on principle can move on. If this forum opposed Obama for reasons of substance...well, those reasons will still be valid Wednesday morning -- win, lose, or draw.

I disagree that we should accept all views. Some views are untenable. You have to stand for something. We should continue to do so. What made this forum great is that we stood proudly for what (we thought) was right.

Or at least I thought that's what we were doing :(

That's what I thought too.

[Meg]

You make it sound like the "hating on Obama" was arbitrary. It has nothing to do with him being "evil." That's simplistic and glib.

I was under the impression that we opposed Obama because of his lack of character, race baiting, encouragement of corruption at the DNC, socialistic tax plan that and ideas on "spread the wealth around"/"radicalize the Constitution"/"redistribute wealth" policies, and lack of foreign policy experience that would invite "international crisis."

Correct me if I'm wrong, but what's going to be different on Wednesday morning except that American voters will have accepted or rejected these as the qualities they want in a President? Is Obama going to stop playing the race card? Is the DNC going to not be corrupt? Will we be okay with redistributing wealth? Will we suddenly agree with a foreign policy that puts the nation at risk?

If this forum simply opposed Obama for arbitrary, nonsensical, revenge minded reasons, then we need to know that so those of us who opposed him on principle can move on. If this forum opposed Obama for reasons of substance...well, those reasons will still be valid Wednesday morning -- win, lose, or draw.

I disagree that we should accept all views. Some views are untenable. You have to stand for something. We should continue to do so. What made this forum great is that we stood proudly for what (we thought) was right.

Or at least I thought that's what we were doing :(


No, some of us have felt that things have gotten so ridiculously anti-Obama and Pro-McCain that we'd rather not come here anymore. And these are members who have been here since the beginning.

As far as some views are untenable, guess what I've put up with conservative views since Hillary conceded and I'm done with sitting back and letting them overtake this forum. I certainly am not by any means going to ever agree with them. Therefore, they are not acceptable to me. For people who want to have a balanced view on politics, after this election there is no reason that we should have to continue to ignore Obama supporter's views. like Talyn said they're not all crazy over-the-top people.

[ZY123]

Well I'm 100% against groupthink of any form. I would never take it upon myself to present the forum's position as a "we" and as a "group". If "we" are a collective "we" and no longer a group of individuals I don't care what "we" are supporting I prefer to be an independent thinker. Independent thinking requires listening to all views and not categorically dismissing the thoughts of an entire group of people. No I didn't support Obama, but some of the people that did...well some of them do support other views (such as No on Prop 8) that I agree with. Without their votes No on Prop 8 wouldn't have a chance.

[Annie]

You make it sound like the "hating on Obama" was arbitrary. It has nothing to do with him being "evil." That's simplistic and glib.

I was under the impression that we opposed Obama because of his lack of character, race baiting, encouragement of corruption at the DNC, socialistic tax plan that and ideas on "spread the wealth around"/"radicalize the Constitution"/"redistribute wealth" policies, and lack of foreign policy experience that would invite "international crisis."

Correct me if I'm wrong, but what's going to be different on Wednesday morning except that American voters will have accepted or rejected these as the qualities they want in a President? Is Obama going to stop playing the race card? Is the DNC going to not be corrupt? Will we be okay with redistributing wealth? Will we suddenly agree with a foreign policy that puts the nation at risk?

If this forum simply opposed Obama for arbitrary, nonsensical, revenge minded reasons, then we need to know that so those of us who opposed him on principle can move on. If this forum opposed Obama for reasons of substance...well, those reasons will still be valid Wednesday morning -- win, lose, or draw.

I disagree that we should accept all views. Some views are untenable. You have to stand for something. We should continue to do so. What made this forum great is that we stood proudly for what (we thought) was right.

Or at least I thought that's what we were doing :(

STAMP!!!

[Horizon]

I'm chiming in here.I have mostly kept silent on this thread but feel the need to let it all hang out after my upset yesterday.
When I get accused of not supporting HRC and am told I have "gone to the other side" It really irks me.It irked me to the point I lost all control of my fingers and posted some pretty nasty things right back out of frustration.And all because I was basically defending HRC and her comments that I felt were being taken out of context.This is a regular occurance anymore.I have seen this happen to a countless number of long time members,and usually by someone who is new and does not quite understand what we are all about.Not agreeing with each other is fine and dandy.That is to be expected with this many people on line daily.But to make wild inflammatory accusations because you do not like what someone is saying,is way out of line.And it happens time and again.Daily I would say.When I see talyn having to defend prop 8 almost to the death,I am a little concerned about where this has been taken and by whom.That was something that would
never have happened 4 months ago.I don't believe that our core values have changed because we voted for a Republican,but it seems as though we are now stifled in what we are "allowed" to talk about.I don't feel comfortable with that,it was never so before.Not all of us were in line with voting for McCain and those people have been made to feel very uncomfortable.This was their home too and that is grossly unfair.
I would like to see us go back to our normal friendly posting that we are used to.With what has been happening,that will take some effort on all our parts.I too am fed as Meg is.I often wonder how many of our members went away when things changed so drastically.

[Meg]

I'm chiming in here.I have mostly kept silent on this thread but feel the need to let it all hang out after my upset yesterday.
When I get accused of not supporting HRC and am told I have "gone to the other side" It really irks me.It irked me to the point I lost all control of my fingers and posted some pretty nasty things right back out of frustration.And all because I was basically defending HRC and her comments that I felt were being taken out of context.This is a regular occurance anymore.I have seen this happen to a countless number of long time members,and usually by someone who is new and does not quite understand what we are all about.Not agreeing with each other is fine and dandy.That is to be expected with this many people on line daily.But to make wild inflammatory accusations because you do not like what someone is saying,is way out of line.And it happens time and again.Daily I would say.When I see talyn having to defend prop 8 almost to the death,I am a little concerned about where this has been taken and by whom.That was something that would never have happened 4 months ago.I don't believe that our core values have changed because we voted for a Republican,but it seems as though we are now stifled in what we are "allowed" to talk about.I don't feel comfortable with that,it was never so before.Not all of us were in line with voting for McCain and those people have been made to feel very uncomfortable.This was their home too and that is grossly unfair.
I would like to see us go back to our normal friendly posting that we are used to.With what has been happening,that will take some effort on all our parts.I too am fed as Meg is.I often wonder how many of our members went away when things changed so drastically.


**STAMP ALL THE WAY!**

And now I can let out a sigh of relief.:eek:

[Horizon]

**STAMP ALL THE WAY!**

And now I can let out a sigh of relief.:eek:

We need a collective sigh of relief!!:rolleyes::rolleyes:

[Alessandro Machi]

Let's not forget that Barack Obama is already setting up for a second term. I think cheating happened in the caucus contests, I think things were rigged against Hillary Clinton long before this year. I don't think I want George Soros's money dictating politics for the next 8 years and beyond.

I also am absolutely disappointed at Barack Obama willingly accepting 200 million dollars in undocumented money for his campaign. This points to a dysfunctional, dishonest personality beyond anything we've seen before.

I actually think NOT forgetting the past, but magnifying it, might be the check and balance needed.

[Tom Terrific]

In the future, the forum may undergo a name change. Do you have any suggestions?

Why?

This is the name under which the forum became famous, a rallying point for all those who reject the politics of thuggery and barbarism. If there is anything we can take out of this election, it is that the best candidate in any party was eviscerated by the criminality, the lies and the betrayal of the fundamental democratic values by the Obama campaign, its surrogates and its supporters. And who is that candidate?

Forums, organizations and clubs often bear the names of people famous for different reasons, long after they or their causes have passed from the scene. This is because, although their objectives are no longer current, the spirit with which they pursued them is eternal. And no slogan or enunciation of a principle rallies our spirits to those ideals and qualities we seek in ourselves as does their embodiment in another human being.

It was Hillary's strength, courage, endurance and determination in the face of the slow, torturous murder of her candidacy that awakened a sea of sleepy supporters to the outrage that has become the Democratic Party and made us remember who we are: Americans first, partisans second. It was Hillary's loss that made it possible for hands and hearts to reach across the aisle and join in common cause for our country: our hands, and our hearts. By keeping the forum name as it is, you will remind people every time they log on of what happened to her, who did it, and why we cannot fall asleep again.

[CGP]

Great points Tom. No final decision has been made.

[Ikasu]

This forum may have gone too far in attacking Obama at times (the real father threads, anything relating Muslims and Obama, etc.), I wish we kept it focused mostly on his policy proposals and "rhetoric vs. record" issues. But I guess the past connections were too juicy to pass up. The forum used to be about political action, getting stuff out to media outlets and while the top posters here tried to keep that way, most of us got lured into attacking Obama for whatever reason. I guess we all got so sick and tired of Obama for everything that he has done.

At times, the vitriol coming from this forum reflects poorly on Hillary Clinton from people just reading the posts. There are some threads that survived too long before getting deleted (the Frank Davis is Obama's father was way over-the-top). Once this election is over, a break is necessary for everyone to forget the election, win or lose for Obama.

I like the idea of a center politics forum. It would be fun to have actual debates. Most of us here agree on everything about this election, too much STAMPING!

[samurai007]

This forum may have gone too far in attacking Obama at times (the real father threads, anything relating Muslims and Obama, etc.), I wish we kept it focused mostly on his policy proposals and "rhetoric vs. record" issues. But I guess the past connections were too juicy to pass up. The forum used to be about political action, getting stuff out to media outlets and while the top posters here tried to keep that way, most of us got lured into attacking Obama for whatever reason. I guess we all got so sick and tired of Obama for everything that he has done.

At times, the vitriol coming from this forum reflects poorly on Hillary Clinton from people just reading the posts. There are some threads that survived too long before getting deleted (the Frank Davis is Obama's father was way over-the-top). Once this election is over, a break is necessary for everyone to forget the election, win or lose for Obama.

I like the idea of a center politics forum. It would be fun to have actual debates. Most of us here agree on everything about this election, too much STAMPING!

I too wouldn't mind seeing more debates on issues, but I've been very careful about discussing hot button issues because a) I didn't want to offend anyone here, and b) I felt there was a definite threat of a ban for expressing too much conservative opinion. No offense Muzza, but when you said (paraphrasing) "If anyone agrees with Prop 8 in CA, better keep it to themselves or else face a ban...", I was very disappointed in that kind of enforced groupthink. It ensured that there would be no debate on the issues, no free expression of beliefs, and no disagreements allowed. Not wanting to be banned, I kept my mouth shut on both Prop 8 (truth is, I am on the fence about that initiative, and could go either way, but I feared expressing anything short of full opposition to it) and how I felt about that kind of requirement on posting your thoughts or feelings on an issue. I think it can definitely be done without attacking or insulting anyone, but you made it sound like such a 3rd rail, of course you aren't going to find anyone saying anything but "Stamp!" I have wanted to state my disagreement with that for a while, and I hope doing so here (where you asked for frank and honest thoughts and opinions about the direction of the forum) will be ok.

And it's not just that issue. Besides the issues everyone can agree on (lower taxes, etc), there has been very little debate on the issues, or posting of conservative ideas here. Of course, we've all been focused on the election. But once that is done with, if we are going to move toward more discussions on the issues, it'll mean having to allow respectfully stated opinions that some may disagree with, from both the left and right. As long as a measure of civility and respect is maintained, I don't see why we couldn't politely discuss differences of opinion on everything from abortion to gun control, illegal aliens to global warming.

IMO, discussion and debate are how one best comes to examine and/or establish their own thoughts and feelings on a given issue. You can't do that without looking at both/multiple sides of an issue. A forum where every single person agrees (or is afraid to disagree) may be comforting to some, but it leads to no new personal insights, no questioning or testing of one's own beliefs, no need to coalesce one's thoughts into a cogent form and support it with facts and rhetoric. A belief that is tried, tested, and debated is far stronger than one that is not, even if your position is unchanged after the debate. That is my firm belief, and it is one reason I spent so many years on message boards with people I disagree with on many issues, rather than in a forum that amounts to an echo chamber.

I hope that this forum will be a place for respectful, intelligent discussions and debates of the issues after the election.

[hobbitt]

I promised myself that having posted once in this thread, that I would refrain from further comment.

Apparently that decision was as effective as my New Years Resolutions.


So in no particular order, more comments from early morning Seattle:

I am in favor of keeping the name as "Hillary Clinton Forum." There are thousands of references out there in Net Land (and even in print news land) and that alone should convince us to keep the name. We have a presence on the web - on Digg (I still have no idea what the hell that is!) and youtube and other social networking sites, as well as a certain reputation of civility, reliability and credibility. We do and will need like-minded individuals to be able to find us.

"Like-minded individuals" - like the grouchy Old Fogie that I am, I long for the good ole days of the Forum. We were activists (remember the calling-for-Hillary threads? And the Media Bias Protest?) and we were influential. We spent time doing the things necessary to help keep Senator Clinton winning. When someone posted a "Bloggers Needed" or "Emails Needed" message, most of us dutifully responded.

We developed and shared email addresses, contact lists, effective posting places. We researched and documented Snail mail addresses and phone numbers. We discovered which sites and sources were believeable and which were doubtful. And we - individually - built reputations as responsible correspondents whose messages were read-worthy.

There were few, if any, discussions or arguments about policy issues. There was little cross-talk, and very few personal attacks (trolls excepted).

Since May, almost 2000 people have joined - and in spite of pleas and jocular admonitions and constant reminders - we have gone off-kilter. Someone (I think it was Freethinker) reminded everyone that this was NOT a chat room. Many have begged folks over and over to check for pre-existing threads before posting.

Chattiness, duplicate (triplicate, quadruplicate) threads are time-wasters, and keep us from doing the work we came here to do. Long threads about policy issues are non-productive. And some people have clearly forgotten that this forum is (was?) for Hillary Clinton supporters, democrats, republicans, liberals, moderates, conservatives, men, women, whoever. Not for Sarah Palin or John McCain or for long diatribes against anyone.

We did -- out of sheer frustration and anger -- get off onto many anti-Obama topics. Understandably. But if you look through the archives, you will see that the early anti_obama threads were research: factual, documented, and terrifying. Not divisive and personal.

There are so many issues which the talented and dedicated members of this forum could work on after today: the elimination of the caucus system, the return to sanity and adulthood in the Democratic Party; the call for HUGE changes in campaign financing (and the unconscionable $700 million dollars plus spent by Obama); the verification of Voter Registrations, and the shocking inaction on the part of states to develop trustworthy voting machines, intra-state voter information and verification; the call for bias-free media reporting; the outrageous and blatant misogyny prevalent in our society; the huge sums of money spent by unions to influence elections; the tendency for "headquarters" of country-wide organizations (e.e. NARAL, NOW) to make unilateral decisions without consulting grassroots chapters; inaction and lack of will on the part of the FEC (it does not help to have the FEC "investigate" after the election is over); the absurdity of granting Fed Funds to obviously partisan "non-profits" (like ACORN and CVP); as well as a more general push to force Congress to act in our favor with celerity: they have already proven that they can get their acts together to pass major Bailout legislation in a week; surely they can pass a school-funding bill or a Veterans Benefits bill within a year; and the general call for the publication of requested earmarks, and the elimination of those stupid "amendments" to bills which have nothing to do with the purpose of that bill.

There are probably a zillion more issues which need attention.

I hope that we can continue to fight the good fight. But not among ourselves.

[ggreen]

I am in favor of keeping the name as "Hillary Clinton Forum." There are thousands of references out there in Net Land (and even in print news land) and that alone should convince us to keep the name. We have a presence on the web - on Digg (I still have no idea what the hell that is!) and youtube and other social networking sites, as well as a certain reputation of civility, reliability and credibility. We do and will need like-minded individuals to be able to find us.

While I can appreciate both arguments regarding the name change, I too, would note that this forum has a sound reputation of credibility. The numerous references across the net, to this site attest to that. It would be a shame if in the future, the forum was referenced and people were unable to find it or understand its evolution.

If "formerly Hillary Clinton Forum" were to be included in a sub-title or such, would that direct people here during searches or when using links?
_

[ZY123]

I too wouldn't mind seeing more debates on issues, but I've been very careful about discussing hot button issues because a) I didn't want to offend anyone here, and b) I felt there was a definite threat of a ban for expressing too much conservative opinion. No offense Muzza, but when you said (paraphrasing) "If anyone agrees with Prop 8 in CA, better keep it to themselves or else face a ban...", I was very disappointed in that kind of enforced groupthink. It ensured that there would be no debate on the issues, no free expression of beliefs, and no disagreements allowed. Not wanting to be banned, I kept my mouth shut on both Prop 8 (truth is, I am on the fence about that initiative, and could go either way, but I feared expressing anything short of full opposition to it) and how I felt about that kind of requirement on posting your thoughts or feelings on an issue. I think it can definitely be done without attacking or insulting anyone, but you made it sound like such a 3rd rail, of course you aren't going to find anyone saying anything but "Stamp!" I have wanted to state my disagreement with that for a while, and I hope doing so here (where you asked for frank and honest thoughts and opinions about the direction of the forum) will be ok.

And it's not just that issue. Besides the issues everyone can agree on (lower taxes, etc), there has been very little debate on the issues, or posting of conservative ideas here. Of course, we've all been focused on the election. But once that is done with, if we are going to move toward more discussions on the issues, it'll mean having to allow respectfully stated opinions that some may disagree with, from both the left and right. As long as a measure of civility and respect is maintained, I don't see why we couldn't politely discuss differences of opinion on everything from abortion to gun control, illegal aliens to global warming.

IMO, discussion and debate are how one best comes to examine and/or establish their own thoughts and feelings on a given issue. You can't do that without looking at both/multiple sides of an issue. A forum where every single person agrees (or is afraid to disagree) may be comforting to some, but it leads to no new personal insights, no questioning or testing of one's own beliefs, no need to coalesce one's thoughts into a cogent form and support it with facts and rhetoric. A belief that is tried, tested, and debated is far stronger than one that is not, even if your position is unchanged after the debate. That is my firm belief, and it is one reason I spent so many years on message boards with people I disagree with on many issues, rather than in a forum that amounts to an echo chamber.

I hope that this forum will be a place for respectful, intelligent discussions and debates of the issues after the election.

Actually there has been little if any liberal discussion of issues here in the last four months (other than my No on Prop 8 thread which received a large number of posts offensive to the entire LGBT community that were deleted). The reason the conservative ideals that are now dominant here aren't challenged is because this is Plan B and we do whatever it takes for No Obama - which is fine, Plan B was Plan B - personally I'm glad it's over.

Not everyone here thinks McCain/Palin have productive plans or beneficial policies for this country - in fact many (not all of course) voted that way as a protest vote only. Some couldn't even bring themselves to vote for them and voted 3rd Party or did a write in - and no you haven't seen that view on the board because people were afraid to express it for fear of being banned.

Posts contrary to Plan B or contrary to the conservative views that have dominated here over the last 60 days have been removed to promote Plan B....now Plan B is over and I suspect you will start to see people that disagree with the conservative policies (especially the social policies) McCain/Palin hold (assuming they win). Assuming they win, I personally will be fighting tooth and nail for many of their policies not to pass and hope for a Democratic congress...I do worry about what SC Justices they will appoint...I do not think their choices will be good for the future of this country. So yes I supported them in protest, but now that that's over, I go back to my core values and beliefs (which for me have not changed).

This board always has had the official position that we are pro-gay rights to the fullest extent. I don't consider this a political issue at all (I think opponents of gay rights have created a false political division on this issue to try to promote their agenda), instead I consider it a human rights issue (in the same regard as discrimination based on race). Should the board make this a political issue to be debated in ways I saw in my No on 8 thread, I will not be able to support that since it goes against everything I stand for morally.

[xfiles]

In my opinion, after all the time, effort and soul searching many of us have put into defeating Obama, I don't see how he or his policies deserve any credibility or debate except negative because underlying all his policies is someone who lied and cheated to get where he is.

When Bush stole the election in 2000, I vowed never to recognize him as my president. For the longest time many of us referred to him as Resident instead of president. I feel the same about Obama multiplied by 100.

I know I won't recognize Obama as president if elected nor his policies, etc. as anything but illegitimate! :mad::mad:

[samurai007]

Actually there has been little if any liberal discussion of issues here in the last four months (other than my No on Prop 8 thread which received a large number of posts offensive to the entire LGBT community that were deleted). The reason the conservative ideals that are now dominant here aren't challenged is because this is Plan B and we do whatever it takes for No Obama - which is fine, Plan B was Plan B - personally I'm glad it's over.

Not everyone here thinks McCain/Palin have productive plans or beneficial policies for this country - in fact many (not all of course) voted that way as a protest vote only. Some couldn't even bring themselves to vote for them and voted 3rd Party or did a write in - and no you haven't seen that view on the board because people were afraid to express it for fear of being banned.

Posts contrary to Plan B or contrary to the conservative views that have dominated here over the last 60 days have been removed to promote Plan B....now Plan B is over and I suspect you will start to see people that disagree with the conservative policies (especially the social policies) McCain/Palin hold (assuming they win). Assuming they win, I personally will be fighting tooth and nail for many of their policies not to pass and hope for a Democratic congress...I do worry about what SC Justices they will appoint...I do not think their choices will be good for the future of this country. So yes I supported them in protest, but now that that's over, I go back to my core values and beliefs (which for me have not changed).

This board always has had the official position that we are pro-gay rights to the fullest extent. I don't consider this a political issue at all (I think opponents of gay rights have created a false political division on this issue to try to promote their agenda), instead I consider it a human rights issue (in the same regard as discrimination based on race). Should the board make this a political issue to be debated in ways I saw in my No on 8 thread, I will not be able to support that since it goes against everything I stand for morally.

I agree there has been little discussion of the liberal issues as well, except for that thread, so far. But I don't see what "conservative views" have really been advanced here. Have there been threads promoting conservative views on the issues, because I missed them. I have seen a very strong "Plan B" emphasis and little to no disagreement with that... was that a natural evolution of the forum after Obama stole the primary or was it enforced? I got the impression it was a fairly natural evolution for many of the people here, and those that said "Well, Hillary lost, guess I'm voting Obama now" just drifted away by and large.

I may be a Republican, but I disagree with McCain on some issues as well. I expect to fight him on a variety of issues, though perhaps not the same issues as you, or in the same direction. But I know I can trust him to lead with honor and put the country first, instead of Obama's socialistic grab for power and fame. I truly, deeply fear for this country under a President Obama, and I don't fear for it under a President McCain, despite some differences on issues, and that's why I'm here, that's why I'm voting for McCain.

Once the election is over, 1 of 2 things will happen: This country will have dodged a massive bullet and elected McCain, we can all breathe a sigh of relief, and get back to other issues. Or our worst fears will be realized and Obama will be the President elect. We will need to be ever-vigilant with him in power, but we'll continue to have a common enemy to unite the Hillary Democrats and conservatives/independents who joined this forum. It will result in much greater forum unity of purpose, but at a terrible cost to our nation and our future.

[samurai007]

In my opinion, after all the time, effort and soul searching many of us have put into defeating Obama, I don't see how he or his policies deserve any credibility or debate except negative because underlying all his policies is someone who lied and cheated to get where he is.

When Bush stole the election in 2000, I vowed never to recognize him as my president. For the longest time many of us referred to him as Resident instead of president. I feel the same about Obama multiplied by 100.

I know I won't recognize Obama as president if elected nor his policies, etc. as anything but illegitimate! :mad::mad:

Someone on another forum asked me the same question... "Will you accept President Obama if he's elected?" I said no way, he'll never be my President, and just as President Bush was referred to as Bush, Mr Bush, or Dubya, so too will I call him Obama, Mr. Obama, or Hussein, but never President Obama. It's a title he neither earned nor deserves.

[JLB123]

If Obama wins....

Get the domain name for The Sarah Palin Forum.

[12counts]

No, some of us have felt that things have gotten so ridiculously anti-Obama and Pro-McCain that we'd rather not come here anymore. And these are members who have been here since the beginning.

As far as some views are untenable, guess what I've put up with conservative views since Hillary conceded and I'm done with sitting back and letting them overtake this forum. I certainly am not by any means going to ever agree with them. Therefore, they are not acceptable to me. For people who want to have a balanced view on politics, after this election there is no reason that we should have to continue to ignore Obama supporter's views. like Talyn said they're not all crazy over-the-top people.

I'd be interested to know which conservative views you mean.

It has been well known since long ago that this forum did not support Obama's candidacy. It didn't support him during the primary. It didn't support him in the general election. If he wins, why should we make a 180 degree turn and support policies and proposals we (generally) disagreed with?

I don't think we've 'ignored' the views of his supporters. One, as Hillary supporters, we share many of them. Two, the views "we" don't share were major, major sticking points, and they are propagated and endorsed all over the mainstream media and on every major blog. The HCF served as a counterpoint and watchdog to that -- a principled and welcome counterpoint. This isn't DU or Kos, nor should it be.

There are things I disagreed with about the forum. I was opposed at first to the infiltration of GOPers, but they brought views we did not have before (unlike Obama supporters' views, which we know). I was vehemently opposed to the Andy Martin/Jerome Corsi/API rumor mongering. But I'm a graduate of the "Hillary Keep Going" school of arts. If the PUMAS lose today, that's when the real battle starts. Are we still there to oppose his tax plan when it comes up for vote in Congress? Are we still there to complain when he race baits? Are we still there to push for primary reform? I am!

I think the reason this forum is now known (and now more popular than, for example, Taylor Marsh's site) is because it had a point of view, it didn't just become another nameless, faceless site for lemmings. With no point of view, why bother?

[Bad Kitty]

I'd be interested to know which conservative views you mean.

It has been well known since long ago that this forum did not support Obama's candidacy. It didn't support him during the primary. It didn't support him in the general election. If he wins, why should we make a 180 degree turn and support policies and proposals we (generally) disagreed with?

I don't think we've 'ignored' the views of his supporters. One, as Hillary supporters, we share many of them. Two, the views "we" don't share were major, major sticking points, and they are propagated and endorsed all over the mainstream media and on every major blog. The HCF served as a counterpoint and watchdog to that -- a principled and welcome counterpoint. This isn't DU or Kos, nor should it be.

There are things I disagreed with about the forum. I was opposed at first to the infiltration of GOPers, but they brought views we did not have before (unlike Obama supporters' views, which we know). I was vehemently opposed to the Andy Martin/Jerome Corsi/API rumor mongering. But I'm a graduate of the "Hillary Keep Going" school of arts. If the PUMAS lose today, that's when the real battle starts. Are we still there to oppose his tax plan when it comes up for vote in Congress? Are we still there to complain when he race baits? Are we still there to push for primary reform? I am!

I think the reason this forum is now known (and now more popular than, for example, Taylor Marsh's site) is because it had a point of view, it didn't just become another nameless, faceless site for lemmings. With no point of view, why bother?

STAMP!

[Alex01]

PUMA PARTY!

http://bestsmileys.com/party/5.gif

.com;)

[samurai007]

I'd be interested to know which conservative views you mean.

It has been well known since long ago that this forum did not support Obama's candidacy. It didn't support him during the primary. It didn't support him in the general election. If he wins, why should we make a 180 degree turn and support policies and proposals we (generally) disagreed with?

I don't think we've 'ignored' the views of his supporters. One, as Hillary supporters, we share many of them. Two, the views "we" don't share were major, major sticking points, and they are propagated and endorsed all over the mainstream media and on every major blog. The HCF served as a counterpoint and watchdog to that -- a principled and welcome counterpoint. This isn't DU or Kos, nor should it be.

There are things I disagreed with about the forum. I was opposed at first to the infiltration of GOPers, but they brought views we did not have before (unlike Obama supporters' views, which we know). I was vehemently opposed to the Andy Martin/Jerome Corsi/API rumor mongering. But I'm a graduate of the "Hillary Keep Going" school of arts. If the PUMAS lose today, that's when the real battle starts. Are we still there to oppose his tax plan when it comes up for vote in Congress? Are we still there to complain when he race baits? Are we still there to push for primary reform? I am!

I think the reason this forum is now known (and now more popular than, for example, Taylor Marsh's site) is because it had a point of view, it didn't just become another nameless, faceless site for lemmings. With no point of view, why bother?

Just 1 quibble... I don't think of it as an "infiltration of the GOP". The conservatives here have never, to my knowledge, hidden or lied about who they are. I know I've stated many times that I'm a Republican, and I've seen others do the same, just so that people are not misled. But I see this as a reaching across the aisle, working with like-minded people toward a common goal, a chance to talk with people we might never have otherwise met and perhaps find some shared beliefs and ideals. For me, that has been one of the greatest joys of this forum, meeting so many Democrats like you all that don't just toe the party line, and won't bow in supplication before the Messiah. I know it has been a learning experience for me, and I hope working with us has been the same for you.

[scully931]

Why?

This is the name under which the forum became famous, a rallying point for all those who reject the politics of thuggery and barbarism. If there is anything we can take out of this election, it is that the best candidate in any party was eviscerated by the criminality, the lies and the betrayal of the fundamental democratic values by the Obama campaign, its surrogates and its supporters. And who is that candidate?

Forums, organizations and clubs often bear the names of people famous for different reasons, long after they or their causes have passed from the scene. This is because, although their objectives are no longer current, the spirit with which they pursued them is eternal. And no slogan or enunciation of a principle rallies our spirits to those ideals and qualities we seek in ourselves as does their embodiment in another human being.

It was Hillary's strength, courage, endurance and determination in the face of the slow, torturous murder of her candidacy that awakened a sea of sleepy supporters to the outrage that has become the Democratic Party and made us remember who we are: Americans first, partisans second. It was Hillary's loss that made it possible for hands and hearts to reach across the aisle and join in common cause for our country: our hands, and our hearts. By keeping the forum name as it is, you will remind people every time they log on of what happened to her, who did it, and why we cannot fall asleep again.


Yes. I changed my mind. It should stay the same. :D

[JLB123]

No, some of us have felt that things have gotten so ridiculously anti-Obama and Pro-McCain that we'd rather not come here anymore. And these are members who have been here since the beginning.

As far as some views are untenable, guess what I've put up with conservative views since Hillary conceded and I'm done with sitting back and letting them overtake this forum. I certainly am not by any means going to ever agree with them. Therefore, they are not acceptable to me. For people who want to have a balanced view on politics, after this election there is no reason that we should have to continue to ignore Obama supporter's views. like Talyn said they're not all crazy over-the-top people.

I'm curious, since I am one of the conservatives that post here.

Just what conservative views do you disagree with?

After you answer that, I would like to know if you have realized that some of the conservative "bogeyman" issues, like abortion, etc... have been overblown by the far left of the Democrat Party (to be fair.....just like gay rights is used on the far right) to keep you from listening to other positions that conservatives and moderates share?

Can we all agree that we love America, and it is the best country in the world?

Can we all agree that America has good intentions, even when we disagree with it's foreign actions, like the war?

Can we all agree that capitalism has been the most successful economic system in history?

Can we put aside the politics of envy and class warfare?

You would be surprised just how tolerant we "conservatives" really are, and just how much common ground we may have with those of you. I certainly have been surprised by how much we have agreed with one another, when drawn together by a common enemy.

Most of us don't care about what you do in your private lives. We just want the Federal government to get out of our lives, and not tell us what we can or cannot do. Isn't that what you want too?

[Disfranchised]

Murray what do you think of PARTY OF NONE!:confused: