What Turned You Off Obama? [Archive] - COMMON GROUND POLITICS

CGP

02-28-2008, 12:40 AM

I originally submitted this list to the Democratic Underground Forum (http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4774697) before they banned me for being too pro-Hillary and too anti-Obama! Over there it's actually Obama Underground and Hillary supporters are pretty much despised despite the fact it's meant to be a mixed forum. Anyway, whatever, I posted it there anyway! And here it is for you below. If you have any reasons to add or have a personal story to tell, please share!

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REASONS WHY I CANNOT SUPPORT OBAMA
(as at Feb 27, 2008)

I am writing this to explain why I cannot support Obama and to make it clear there is a logical, valid basis for why many people do not support him. I must admit that my dislike for him has intensified only recently. I previously liked him when he first started getting media attention. Granted I didn't know much about him in 2006/2007 but I thought he seemed likeable, attractive, charismatic and the prospect of a younger leader and man of color leading the country some day seemed exciting. But then things changed and bit by bit I began to turn from Obama...Here are some of the reasons which have certainly contributed to my rejection of him as a leader:

1. Anti-gay politics - Inviting anti-gay homophobe McClurkin to his campaign events in Oct 2007. I mean, that would be like Hillary Clinton inviting a member of the KKK to her campaign events - can you imagine the hysteria that would result? How dare Obama invite this man to his events and than claim to be a unifier?! Add in the story from 2004 when Obama refused to be in a photograph with the Mayor of San Francisco, who at that time was authorizing same sex marriage, and it's not looking good for gay rights.

2. South Carolina - Accusing Hillary Clinton, or alluding to the possibility, that she and her husband were racist. To me that entire affair was Obama's desperate attempt to turn African-American votes away from Hillary Clinton and it worked. It was actually Obama's campaign who sent around a 4 page memo trying to whip up hysteria through the media in relation to this issue.

3. Iraq War position - the weakness of his position & his constant criticism of Clinton's actions way back really irk me. I find Obama's claim of the higher-ground in relation to the Iraq War very weak. The reality is that he was not in the US Senate when these decisions were made and he had nothing to do with it. It's very easy to sit on the sidelines and make all kinds of promises about a decision he had no part of. Had he been in the US Senate at that time and opposed the war, then I would credit him accordingly and he would have moral authority on this issue. But he wasn't and therefore he has no moral claim on this issue. He has voted to authorize war funding year after year. So where is the REAL opposition?

4. Hypocrisy in relation to special interests - Obama goes on and on about doing politics in a new way and not being controlled by special interests groups when in actual fact he has a long history of financial support from lobbyists and special interests groups. It astounds me that he still claims moral authority on this issue as well when he really doesn't have any right to considering his history of associations with lobbyists and special interest groups. He also has nil hesitation in dishing out hundreds of thousands of dollars to superdelegates - sounds like "establishment" behavior to me!

5. Criticism of Clinton's health care agenda and policy of mandating health insurance - As a firm believer in universal health care, I find it very difficult to support any politician who attacks another politician who tries to achieve this goal. It is so blatantly obvious that mandating health insurance coverage is the only way to achieve universal health care in the USA. Obama's fearmongering in relation to this has really offended me. He's tried to scare people into thinking that Clinton's health care policy will force some people into poverty just to get them covered with health insurance. Totally misleading. I also found his cheap dismissal of Clinton's previous 1990s attempts at health care reform to be very disrespectful - when he has tried to do something similar and succeeds, maybe then his criticism will hold more weight.

6. Sexism & ageism towards Hillary Clinton:
(a) behavior: completely dismissing Hillary Clinton's 35 years of public service experience as being meaningless and irrelevant. If Obama had Clinton's resume we'd never hear the end of it! But suddenly when a woman has experience, it doesn't mean anything. The entire Obama campaign is premised on the negative notion that SHE (Clinton) is old, boring, and uninspiring whereas HE (Obama) is young, exciting and inspirational. Obama has used his male privilege and youth privilege as leverages to dismiss Clinton's obviously more impressive public service and political resume and I find that offensive. It shows a complete lack of respect for her, both as a woman and as a more mature person.
(b) rudeness: snubbing Clinton at the State of the Union when he was becoming close buddies with Ted Kennedy who ironically is part of that "establishment" that Obama claims to have no allegiance to...
(c) language: eg saying Clinton was "likeable enough" (he should never have answered that question in that way), the comment about "when she's feeling down...the claws come out"

7. Arrogantly dismissing all political achievements of others before his arrival on the national political stage: Sure, there's plenty to fault about politics in Washington but this line that "all good ideas die in Washington" is complete and utter nonsense. So how did the USA get to where it is today in 2008? Not one good idea became a practical success in Washington before 2008? Give me a break. This notion that Obama's arrival signals a new era in politics is one which I completely dispute & dismiss.

8. Dishonesty about use of Deval Patrick's speech material & completely dismissing the importance of crediting sources when using other people's material. What kind of message does this send to people? That it's ok to plagiarize, as long as it's from a buddy? To me this completely called into question Obama's character and ethics.

9. Hypocrisy - claiming to be above "dirty politics" but being more than willing to engage in it when the cameras aren't rolling: eg South Carolina hysteria, accusing Clinton of plagiarism after the Texas debate, the "harry & sally" healthcare mailer. I understand that politics can involve smear and dirty games, and fair enough, but don't claim you are above it and then keep doing it! That's called hypocrisy - saying one thing and doing another!

10. Empty promises - It worries me that Obama has "drawn in" new voters to the voting process with his "yes we can" message. How despondent and disillusioned will they feel when they come down from the clouds and realize that achieving monumental changes isn't as easy as chanting "yes we can"? I am a reasonable and open-minded person who is open to an engaging and connecting a charismatic style of leadership. But with Obama, my clear sense is that there is a lack of authenticity in many of his promises - combine this with all of the above 9 factors and I am than unable to hear anything he has to say.

11. Behavior of SOME (not all) Obama fans. I think that Obama, as a leader of a supposed "movement" has to take some responsibility for the behavior of his followers and his impact on them. Never in my life have I seen so much filth and vile language spread across the Internet about one person as I have seen with the online vilification of Hillary Clinton during this election. The amount of anti-Hillary hate and smear that has infected youtube, facebook, myspace, forums and news blogs is mind boggling. And a significant chunk of this is new and has been contributed by pro-obama fanatics. Seeing all of this filth, and being subjected to attacks from obsessed Obama supporters, I began to question once again how "unifying" Obama really was if significant numbers of his followers believe it's ok to infect the Internet with so much hate about one person. That's a worry.

TO BE CONTINUED...

(UPDATE 3/31/08 - I wrote the above 11 points more than a month back. I could probably add about another 20 points by now in addition to those above if I had the energy to do so! It's very tiring...)

BooskerD

02-28-2008, 10:38 AM

I was leery from the start.

1. Obama has never distinguished himself in any way. He gained office in Illinois by default.

2. Obama had Donnie McClurkin appear at one of his rallies. While he claims this was done to give all people "a voice", it doesn't ring true to me.

3. His refusal to be photographed with San Francisco mayor Gavin Newsom (because of Newsom's support of gay marriage) makes me very leery indeed.

4. Obama has stated that he will recognize and work with "rogue governments". Bad idea.

5. Obama states he was against the Iraq war from the inception- a statement that falsely alludes that he voted against it at a time when he wasn't able to vote for or against it.

6. Sleazy dealings with Tony Rezko. Wouldn't be amazed if he ends up being indicted at some point.

7. The mindless sound bites that Obama and all his minions use when asked about real issues- leads me to believe there is no substance to him or his platform. For example: Ask an Obama supporter why they support him or how he plans to accomplish x, y or z and they are likely to reply "Hope! Change!" or "Barack the vote!" They are like cult members.

Finally, like Murray, I am put off by the ready use of insults and obscenities by Obama supporters. I'm not certain if checking one's brain at the door is a result of becoming an Obama supporter or if it's a pre-requisite. I followed the Larry Sinclair story on You Tube and was appalled by the cruel and disgusting comments left by some of Obama's supporters. These sick, anti-gay remarks were left by people who claim to be inspired by Obama, people who claim Obama will "unite" us all. I don't really buy that this guy thinks gays are even close to o.k.

I hate that the media has thus far handled Obama with kid gloves. I hate how attacks on Hillary are of such a personal nature. Bottom line, I don't trust Obama. Call it female intuition or whatever...I get a very bad feeling about him.

CGP

02-28-2008, 11:36 PM

Boosker - thanks for your list. I find it intriguing to read about the experiences others have had in terms of their reactions to Obama. It's very interesting...

BooskerD

02-29-2008, 09:59 AM

You're welcome. Unfortunately, I'm not nearly as articulate as you...:)

CGP

02-29-2008, 02:27 PM

You're welcome. Unfortunately, I'm not nearly as articulate as you...:)

Thanks for the compliment. I should hope that after spending about 1/4 of my lifetime at university that I developed a few writing skills!

wv voter

02-29-2008, 11:10 PM

I agree with your list. It is almost identical to mine. I had at one time thought that the Clinton-Obama ticket would be nice, but after awhile, because of all the reasons you have stated and a few more, I reconsidered that. Thanks for puting your list in. You have stated it much better than I ever could.:)

wv voter

02-29-2008, 11:13 PM

BooksterD > I also agree with you. I am glad I have found this forum. Thanks you two (you and Murray) for stating what every body should already, (but don't), see.

Brooke

02-29-2008, 11:21 PM

I love all the lists. I'd been leery of him since the get go and I was bothered by the fact that he was running for President so soon. I remember when he gave his DNC speech in 2004 I saw bumper stickers that said "Obama/Edwards 2012" I don't think anybody anticipated this at all. I would have been all for that. Okay, these aren't really issue related since I don't have much to add in that regard, just personal problems I have.

-The fact that he stumbles whenever asked a tough question.

-His "I didn't vote for the war" manta. Of course you didn't vote for the war, you didn't have ANYTHING to do with the process!!!

-His tone during his speeches. Sounds more like a Southern Baptist preacher than a Presidential candidate from ILLINOIS. Crap, Hillary's got more of a Chicago twang than he does and she hasn't lived there in 40 some years.

-Association with Lous Farrakahn, enough said.

-The Rezko thing

-His lack of foreign policy knowledge, drives me insane. He always defers to Hillary on those questions in the debates and passes it off as being polite. He does it because he doesn't know anything on the question and Hillary has to answer it so he can just repeat what she says and pass it off as his own viewpoint.

-His supporters verbally abusing Bill in public. Not only do I not tolerate that kind of treatment towards people I care about, but if any of us Hillary supporters did that to Michelle Obama..oh..my..god.

wv voter

02-29-2008, 11:32 PM

CGP

03-01-2008, 07:54 AM

CGP

03-01-2008, 07:57 AM

It is his one and only reply. He says that not only will he be ready but he will be right. He bases that on the same old pat and standard answer that he was right about the war and Hillary was not.

That answer from BO always irritates me! So easy to be "right" about a decision he had no part in making! Gauranteed if he had been the US Senate at that time he would have supported it. He is not a man who goes against the tide - heck, look at this voting record - and he would have supported it. And he hasn't made ANY stand against the war since entering the US Senate so he really should SHUT UP on this issue as he has ZERO claim to moral authority in this instance!

Comet

03-01-2008, 08:12 AM

Brooke

03-01-2008, 10:11 AM

I agree with all your reason that is why i will never vote for him plus to mention he is to cocky thinks he knows it all to in experienced. Think i fear for this country if he gets elected in i thought Bush was bad. :eek:

You and me both, Comet!! I think he's going to be just as bad a President, if not worse than Bush was. I'm scared to death.

Robin Orlowski

03-01-2008, 10:34 AM

The anti-gay thing was my initial reason. I have been a long time advocate for GLBT equality. You cannot run around calling for change and social justice while then partnering with an anti-gay speaker.

Then, as I did more research on his record, I found ties to big business, slum lords, and the health care industry--the health care industry not coincidentally opposes any substantive reform in America's current policies.
I hold a masters degree and am an American citizen, but only because of my epilepsy, the insurance companies can PROHIBIT me from buying their plans--regardless of my being employed.

Because anybody themselves can become a person with a disability and get classified as having a pre-existing condition when they need to change plans, I don't understand how they can support this guy! It simply confounds rational explaination.

Beyond the 'speeches' he is literally leading the masses off to slaughter because they will increasingly be unable to afford adequate health care---to say nothing of life-saving surgeries. What is he drugging the masses with?

CGP

03-02-2008, 12:52 AM

wv voter

03-02-2008, 03:57 AM

I was on yahoo answers in the election section a while ago. You should see the way the obama supporters act in their. You can give them links to sites that will tell them about obama, and they won't even check it out. They get mad and say we are trying to trick them. One even said he was getting tired of us trying to bamboosle him. Its like they can't see beyond what he says. But I do think I got one person to check on it. Because he later came on and ask a question how can we trust obama. He cited the reasons that were on one of the sites that I had put in an answer. So if I can persuade even one, I will keep trying. I love this site. thanks.:) Oh, and the language you were talking about, gets used by some of obama supporters on there to. But the good thing is you can report them and if two people report them, their question or answer will be deleted.

CGP

03-02-2008, 04:17 AM

I love this site. thanks.:)

Noted :)

If this forum can jolt a few people back into reality, than it will have served its purpose!

BooskerD

03-02-2008, 01:28 PM

IBut I do think I got one person to check on it. Because he later came on and ask a question how can we trust obama. He cited the reasons that were on one of the sites that I had put in an answer. So if I can persuade even one, I will keep trying. I love this site. thanks.:) Oh, and the language you were talking about, gets used by some of obama supporters on there to. But the good thing is you can report them and if two people report them, their question or answer will be deleted.

I'm impressed- I really thought Obamamaniacs were unreachable! Kudos to you for you for winning one over, or at least getting him to question things a bit.

BooskerD

03-02-2008, 01:32 PM

When he is asked about why he thinks he will be ready on day one, he always says the same thing. It is his one and only reply. He says that not only will he be ready but he will be right. He bases that on the same old pat and standard answer that he was right about the war and Hillary was not. I would like for one time for a reporter to continue on that and ask him this: Yes we know that is your stance, but what I would like to know is, other than your pat and standard reason, can you tell me what else makes you the right person, with the right qualifications to be the President of the United States from day one? Then people would see just how bad he hums and haws over a question.:)

I am so sick and tired of those answers, too. How can any reasonable person listen to his responses and actually think they're good answers? How can people not think to delve a bit deeper? Honestly, I feel like we really know nothing about the guy at all and what I do know makes me very uneasy. I'm tired of the same old sound bites.

Qulin

03-02-2008, 03:41 PM

What turned me off on Obama is he preys on the youth vote. I myself fell to that with Reagan back in the 80's. It was the first time I could vote, he left me purely disgusted. I have never voted for another republican since. To see a candidate within the democratic party behaving the same way as republicans we have gotta beware.

Really, Bush claimed to be this big uniter and see where that has left us. This country cannot afford to make another mistake of falling into false hopes. The Obamanuts think hope is everything, well it ain't. The reality of the situations this country is in is because of statements of false hope.

I don't even think Obama gives a good speech because its all spin. I want beef.

I want a person who knows the issues and how to make changes occur. That person is Hillary Clinton.

CGP

03-02-2008, 08:30 PM

What turned me off on Obama is he preys on the youth vote. I myself fell to that with Reagan back in the 80's. It was the first time I could vote, he left me purely disgusted. I have never voted for another republican since. To see a candidate within the democratic party behaving the same way as republicans we have gotta beware.

This has disgusted me as well. He has lured young voters with dishonesty and false promises. And he and his campaign have engaged in the same way to lure African-American voters and anti-war voters. In my mind, they have all been conned!

CGP

03-02-2008, 09:29 PM

I don't even think Obama gives a good speech because its all spin. I want beef.

You might get a chuckle out of the name of the website featured in the thread below!

http://www.hillaryclintonforum.net/discussion/showthread.php?t=520

floorrunner

03-03-2008, 03:08 AM

My biggest problem with him is that he can't take a stand on things regardless of the outcome. In the Cleveland debate, he had trouble rejecting Louis Farrakhan.
If he has trouble taking a stand on something like this, what else will he have trouble taking a stand on? I can not support anyone that will only speak up when it is convenient. To me this shows that he will not be able to make a quick decision if that call comes at 3am. Bravo to Hillary for forcing him to do it.
Bravo to all those black superdelegates who will not waver in their support of Hillary. I believe it was representative Watson in California. She believes so strongly in Hillary Clinton that she will not waver in her support, even if it harms her political career. All of these people were elected to represent everyone, not just those that voted for her.

wv voter

03-03-2008, 04:44 AM

I couldn't agree with you more. I just can't figure out how people are so blinded by his pep rally tactics. We are in big trouble if he makes it in.

wv voter

03-03-2008, 04:54 AM

I was rereading your list and I noticed the one on Rezko. I was just wondering, have you ever been to this websit?
http://zcommunications.org/znet/viewarticle/16601
If you don't mind. Take a look at it. Tell me what you think about it. And maybe Murray could too, if you don't mind.
I will check back later. Thanks.

03-03-2008, 06:03 PM

My very first problem with him was that he had the audacity to challenge somone within the party who is older and has more experience. In this case it was Hillary but he is so full of himself that he would have challenged any other Democratic contender. My gut feeling was further confirmed when I read the story of how he treated his mentor, Alice Palmer, when he ran for state senator of Illinois.

During his tenure as state senator 1996 - 2000, he was the only senator who voted against legislation that forbade early prison release of child predators. Who in their right mind wants to entrust their children to him???????

His twisting of Bill Clinton's comments about Jesse Jackon's presidential race in North Carolina and using it to cry racism. That made me sick, yet it was foreseeable. That is the card he'll be playing every time he won't get his way and that's what all his worshippers will accuse us of if we dare challenge the hope-and-change BS.

His reluctance to denounce Louis Farrakhan's support.

The way he uses the African-American community as his convenience. He claims he hates rap yet his victory song when he was elected US Senator was "I Got 99 Problems (But A B!tch Ain't One Of Them)" by rapper Jay-Z.
The way he recently belittled the State of the Black Union and didn't show up because he had "elsewhere to be" and offering to send his unproud-American wife instead. When host Tavis Smiley expressed dismay over his snubbing, Smiley and family members were harrassed over it.

His complete denial of the importance of womens' issues. When arguing with an Obamanot recently over it, all she could afford was "he's strongly pro-choice and has been pro-active on increasing healthcare for women, in his state and federal positions. His voting record on women's reproductive rights is 100%.":rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

DUH!!!!!! I told this blinded fool that her demi-god was still in diapers when Hillary was doing these things! She's been doing it all her life and she's got the track record to prove it - where his proof of action and/or voting record?!?!"

There are many others, but I'd be here forever. These are the ones that really irk me.

joeysky18

03-04-2008, 03:25 AM

CGP

03-04-2008, 03:36 AM

There are many others, but I'd be here forever. These are the ones that really irk me.

I could write a page agreeing with each of your criticisms and concerns! I share your dismay and anger in regards to each of the concerns you identified.

It is becoming more and more apparent that Obama is extremely narcissistic and this then explains everything!

CGP

03-04-2008, 03:38 AM

SantaCruzen

03-06-2008, 05:26 PM

I wrote Sen. Hillary Clinton on the night or mid-night of Election Day 2004. I was disgusted that George W. Bush could be a two-term President. Well, I had been to the Veterans For Peace Conference and had a friend who lost her son in Iraq. Another friend introduced two friends who invited my friend to attend a Fundraiser for Sen. Kerry during his campaign for President. At that event, my friend was introduced to Sen. Clinton. Okay, my friend is a grieving mother and she was not consoled with her visit with Sen. Clinton. But from what she told me, being a Veteran myself, I could understand the words Sen. Clinton had given to her. I could tell that Sen. Clinton thinks a lot like someone who is disciplined and prepared for the military. So, the night that we all got the news about Bush, I wrote a long and endearing letter to Sen. Clinton urging her to run for President.

I waited for Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton to run like a lot of other people.

However, as for Turn Offs.

Being born during a highly racial period of the history of the San Francisco Bay Area, knowing many people of diversity, I am a skeptic. I am not a Racial Appologist. I am an Inter-racial realist.

My first hint is that BO was aiming at sentiments towards himself for being a single parent raised child. I am too and so are a lot of other people who's fathers went to Vietnam when I was a born. He is born to two racial castes. My grandmother is German-Cherokee, my father is German-Cherokee Filipino. I know what racism is and does. I know that Martin Luther King, Jr. made it clear in his papers on racism in 1958 that poverty is the issue that divides people not skin color. He made that clear when he stated that he realized while working for a factory in high school that white men were treated like slaves as much as the negros of the times. So, I know that BO was fishing for Race Apologists and that turned me off from the moment I got wind of his tactics. In his own words, he is Gaming the System--using the Race Card for a Free Pass.

Now, BO takes this absolutely elitist view on Health Care. He was able to actually get away with pretending the his Health Care plan is for Americans. Oh come on BO. I attended a filming of the Santa Cruz Earth Vision Film Festival, an International Environmental Film Festival last night. Just A Lawn, a film about a Canadian young man who has been challenging the system to ban pesticides which are known to cause non-Hogkins lymphoma. Now, there are all kinds of hazardousn materials and toxic waste which have caused diseases. In essence, BO does not know Jack about the Environment Movement or the Environmental diseases which cause populations to become ill--not just the children. Bo is irresponsible and disrespectful of Americans.

As a Veteran, I feel that BO knows nothing about tactics of real enemies. He has some notions which are really alarming.

SantaCruzen

03-06-2008, 06:15 PM

I originally submitted this list to the...

TO BE CONTINUED...

I am just going to let you state the facts. I am confident that your points will point to my own conclusions.

samkm

03-07-2008, 04:23 PM

Lack of self-respect.

He does not own his words.
He does not own his name.
He does not spell his plans.

He is disloyal to someone who supported him to the senate job.
He finally got the senate job by using his legal skills and knocking the voters' voice (by emptying others off the ballot).

He does not really identify with the American experience.

He uses code words like "brother" without having done much for "brother" or "sister"

He does not have much accomplishments to speak of.

He has really not done anything actively against war. Talk is real cheap, especially when you dont have to push the green/red button.

He presses the yellow button far too often. ("Abstain")

He does NOT abstain from drugs and uses cigarettes far too often. Poor role model.

He thinks it is quite ok to be in cahoots with Rezko.

He thinks he can hoodwink the Americans. And, he thinks he can complain of others hoodwinking.

He thinks he can bamboozzle others by using the word bamboozzle.

He has not said anything about gays and lesbians (not really) definitive and yet get support. He has mastered being the "didnt say anything" so I am a supporter.

He did not press green button on the gun control bill he sponsored.

Well.... He speeks to appeal to the people feeling negative sentiments and negative emotions.. by pressing hot buttons. Without giving them real anchors and solutions.. .so keeps them hanging.. and hanging onto his words in the HOPE of getting their problems solved easily. Well, dream on! We need solutions and the brilliance of Hillary's plans. Just visit www.hillaryclinton.com and check under pull down menu ISSUES.

The very thought of Hillary's clear, comprehensive, true and well thoughtout, brilliant solutions to the systemic problems we face makes me feel great.
Yes, I think this is a good place to stop and go make phonecalls.

Thanks fellow Hillary supporters. Please donate, ask others to donate, make phonecalls. We can and we will make a BIG difference. It felt great on 3/5 night. We can, we will, we have done it already, and we are part of this movement. Let's do this for ourselves, for Hillary and for America!

Optixmom

03-07-2008, 05:12 PM

As I mentioned on the HRC blogsite early this year, I have been a Conservative Republican for my entire adult life. I have a strong religious conviction and am pretty conservative the way I live my life. That said, the only reason why I left my party is because I believe Senator Clinton represents me and is my voice. If she was not the Democratic Nominee, these are the reasons why I would have a difficult time supporting Obama:

1. He has a poor work ethic. I admire Senators and Representatives that are elected and go to work. They go to sessions and vote based on the way their constituency would want them to vote. Obama's record in the Illinois Congress and the US Senate are abysmal. We pay him to represent us, not to keep the chair from floating away and vote "present".

2. He doesn't have a good radar for people of poor character and morals...i.e. Rezko. He referred to his friendship and relationship with Rezko as "boneheaded", well...I don't want another boneheaded move in choosing a Secretary of State OR Secretary of Defense OR Attorney General, ETC.

3. He has no Foreign Policy experience. Nada, nil, nothin'. He hasn't served on any committee that keeps the Senate or Congress up to date on what is going on in the world. There is no way that he can put any dent in our economy unless he knows how to deal with China or Russia...and lets not even talk about Israel. George W. had no foreign policy experience either and look where that got us!

4. He is blatantly sexist. Using terms like "whining" and refers to Senator Clinton standing up for herself as "claws" coming out. He called the Florida primary a "beauty contest".

5. He has his taxes completed and I don't. This is evidence to me that he lives an easy life, because I won't file until early April. Being self-employed means that I have an extremely complicated tax form. I have to itemize everything...just a nightmare. I understand why Senator Clinton and President Clinton don't have theirs completed. I bet Oprah doesn't have hers completed either. I think this negative he is trying disparately to push upon Senator Clinton is pitiful.

ProHiLL

03-07-2008, 05:28 PM

The koolaid tastes funky!:D

Optixmom

03-07-2008, 06:59 PM

Obama reminds me of previous lab partners of mine. The ones who act all entitled. They align themselves with the movers and shakers in the class to look the part, then they skip lab or don't do the write-ups and expect their lab partners to take up the slack. They get the good grades of their lab partners without having to exert any effort or do any of the work.

This is how I feel about those bills that he touts as his own. Like that Coburn Transparency Act...it just feels like he got his name put down on the bill as a co-sponsor and didn't do any of the work. That is just how it feels to me. I don't understand how someone can miss 182 senate votes in 3 years and do anything of substance on his own. If he cannot be bothered to vote in the Senate, how do I know he can be bothered to work on any legislation?

Amanda2489

03-07-2008, 07:22 PM

OkieforHRC2008

03-07-2008, 08:23 PM

I have to agree with most everything you all have posted and the one thing that gets me is when he talks about "not just being ready on day one, but being RIGHT on day one". This really bothers me because he has this elitist I'm better, smarter, and more well spoken than you attitude. How does he know he will always only make RIGHT decisions. I think some of our BEST presidents have made bad decisions, Bill Clinton being one of them. He was the best president we've had in my lifetime and true he made bad decisions but my opinion is still the same of him because of all the good he did for our country. I just can't see Obama getting over his hollier than thou attitude and getting the job done.

I totally agree with you. No one can always be right, unless they aren't human. People learn from their mistakes, grow, and most of the time become better for it. He sounds like he hasn't had to struggle for anything in his life.
He states his time doing drugs and messing up his life, and acts like it was no big deal. I don't want someone who is easily manipulated.. "a blank slate" in his own words. His inability to be honest, and stealing of speeches really gets under my skin. I'm a writer, and the fact that he thinks copying is no big deal... It makes me want to scream!

I also remember quite fondly the days he said he wasn't going to run for president cause he didn't have the experience. His own tangled webs have been left out there for the world to see, yet some are so blinded by his "celebrity".

~~OkieforHRC2008

Stop the Obamination!

mary57

03-07-2008, 09:58 PM

The Obama question reminds me of the olds saying about weddings vs. marriage. The saying is: "A wedding is a day; a marriage is a lifetime." To me, Obama is focused on the wedding, the today of his campaign: he's obsessed about superdelegates, he's so intent on getting the upper hand he steals words from other people's speeches (doesn't matter if the other writer is your friend, it's still plagarism); increasingly, we're hearing about how he works to say just the right thing to each crowd in order to get their votes, even if he knows the policy he is sharing isn't truly workable in the oval office. In contrast, Hillary is looking at the race as a marriage. She sees the long-range of this quest; she speaks in specific detail about what she would do in the oval office on day one; she talks about solutions and making a difference in the lives of every American...not jsut those who supported her, not just one specific race or gender....every American. So which is the better focus? Wedding days are fun and I admit I do like to eat the cake...but if I'm looking for a President, I want to choose someone who is dedicated for the long haul, who understands that once the media glitz and crowds of the campaign trail are past, the Presidency is about rolling up her sleeves and working day in and day out through good times and bad.

RachachaSharon

03-07-2008, 10:50 PM

My response to Obama was visceral. I've never experienced anything like it before. I don't like him and I will not vote for him - nor will my husband. We have discussed this (ad nauseum according to my husband) and cannot find any redeeming qualities in the man.

I, too, am tired of his claiming he was against the war from the beginning on the basis of a speech he made when he was an Illinois State Senator. If he had been privy to the same information that Congress had, I'll bet he would have voted with Hillary.

In debates, he feeds off Sen. Clinton. I find it ironic that he made it through Harvard without the ability to debate. Hillary really buried him in the debates.

What I find most objectionable is BO's utter lack of respect for Senator Clinton and former President Clinton. Hillary is brilliant and knows what she's about.

I object to Obama's rudeness and arrogance.

Has anyone noticed his total disdain for Bill Clinton's accomplishments as president? In my opinion, President Clinton was one of the best presidents of the 20th Century.

Furthermore, I CANNOT for the life of me picture Michelle Obama in the White House, representing the United States in any way, shape or form. In an Associated Press article by Calvin Woodward in our local paper yesterday, Michelle Obama was quoted as saying about Bill Clinton: "I want to rip his eyes out!" Oh, yeah, I want this twit in the White House. NOT.

Max565

03-09-2008, 09:02 AM

He isn't Hillary Clinton. That's my main reason for not liking him.

xfiles

03-09-2008, 11:44 AM

My List:

Obama's (bad) judgment:

1. Aligning himself with Rezko for 20 years, pretending to only know him casually for a few. Sticking with Rezko even after he knew he was being indicted.

2. His "association" with Ayers, former terroist/bomber

3. The Canadian NAFTA falafel

4. The land deal with Rezko/wife making Obama's property appreciate in value

5. His drug use

6. His criticizing the situation in Afghanistan and Iraq but failing to hold a single oversight committee meeting due to his important run for the presidency.

7. Saying he was not the type to run for president with little experience--didn't feel comfortable, wouldn't do it.

8. His church affiliation whose pastor has a great admiration for Louis Farrahkan.

9. In his book "Dreams from My Father", he extolls the virtues of Kenya, his black brothers and dismisses his white family who raised him--calls them racist.

10. His refusal to wear an American flag lapel pin to prove some point about "doing" rather than "wearing".

11. His refusal to put his hand over his heart during the national athem (maybe not required but nonetheless stupid and arrogant not to).

12. He romantacizes Reagan--says the repub. party had ideas for over a decade (why didn't he add, albeit bad ideas? He has foot in mouth disease when he is speaking off the cuff!

13. Says he will meet with good and bad/evildoer leaders. Knows nothing about diplomacy and the carrot and stick approach obviously.

14. Repeatedly points out that he was against the war but has conceded that had he actually been in the Senate at the time he made the speech and had the briefings, etc. he might have felt differently.

15. Was it a good judgment on Obama's part hiring and having Austan D. Goolsbee as his senior economic policy adviser after what happened at the latest "Nafta" issue?

16. In a debate Obama told a story of a captain (should be lt. as they command platoons) and his platoon using weapons from the enemy and piecing together their weapons due to a shortage. Well, he voted not to fund....hmmmm. He lied 8 times! Either that or he has a very poor memory. Not presidential at all!

http://www.ifimpresident.com/digitalnews/blog/b2798_Obama_lies_at_Texas_debate/

Well, you get the picture!

On the one hand he says he has the better judgment and when confronted with his dealing with Rezko and other things, he says he made a mistake, did some "bone headed things".

Which is it Barack, are you bone headed or are you better at judgment?

I think I know the answer.

CGP

03-09-2008, 12:14 PM

Well, you get the picture!

On the one hand he says he has the better judgment and when confronted with his dealing with Rezko and other things, he says he made a mistake, did some "bone headed things".

Which is it Barack, are you bone headed or are you better at judgment?

I think I know the answer.

Your list is outstanding.

And in relation to your last question, I think the answer is neither - "bone headed" implies naiivity (he's not naiive) and "poor judgment" implies he is concerned with achieving ethical outcomes (I don't think he is). The real problem is BO's extreme discomfort with the truth. So much dishonesty from where I see things. His entire campaign is rooted in the deception of key voting groups - young people, first-time voters, african-american people, leftist "no war" educated white liberals, and anyone else he thinks he can momentarily win over. It's all very disturbing what is going on. And obvious to those who are open to the truth.

Soren

03-09-2008, 12:22 PM

He isn't Hillary Clinton. That's my main reason for not liking him.

I love that reason most of all: He isn't Hillary! I started to get suspicious when my two best Republican friends told me in the Autumn to like him. That made me think.

Next, I started disliking him when he said in a speech that the only Presidency with ideas in the past 25 years was a Republican presidency. He got away with that by having his supporters say, "Well he didn't say they were good ideas." When Rhodes and other "progressives" defended that statement and picked apart Clinton for it, we were in deep trouble in terms of discourse.

I didn't like him when I saw he rests on too many "No" answers and not enough "yes" answers - except that "yes we can" slogan. But really it seems like "no": No, I didn't vote. No, I wouldn't vote. No, I don't like the past. No, I won't take lobbiest money (I have found a different funnel to get that same lobbiest money - see another post in here about how Obama gets money from lobbiests). No, I don't want everyone to have health care. No, my wife didn't mean she was not proud when she said not proud. No, we didn't say anything to Canada. No, I won't run a negative campaign. No I don't have time for a photo with Nusim. No, I am not a Muslim. No, I did not act smartly when I bought my house. No, I won't run on a shared ticket. No, I won't necessarily follow my own plan to get the troops home. No, no, no. No, I won't tell you what I'll do - but it'll be different. No, I don't smoke any more.

I liked him big time for a good hour or 2 when I first read and then heard his SC acceptance speech. Then someone "awoke" me to the fact that he was reading it all off teleprompters. Well, duh to me, but I like my inpsiration when it comes out spontaneously. I know, it's very romantic or Hollywood of me, but I like authenticity. Still, it was a marvelous speech that he edited and delivered, but it was just a speech - so I went back to only a gentle dislike of him, which was actually just a preference for my Hillary, which remained. It was then I knew I was a loyalist to Hillary. But I didn't hate him.

Next I went to a Hillary rally. Whoosh! I became head over heels for Hill. It got so "bad", my Hillarization, that my friend came over one night and suggested that we try to like Obama - as if there were no Hillary in the picture and we just wanted to get to know this new guy.

Well, I tried, but I only disliked him with more granularity after I journied into his web site to see if I could train myself to like him. I could not. I found his archived speeches like boring college lectures. I found the audience like "Invasion of the Body Snatchers" victims. I found brief bulleted lists of solutions under "Issues." I found that "Women's Issues" was missing. I didn't like the re-designed flag and I didn't like the family picture in the little cloud on the Home Page. I'm electing a person, not a family. The whole thing smacked of a "corporate" look to me and - it was not my taste. It seemed "remote" and packaged. I like Hillary's funky little red-white-and blue job and the mix of both honest and flattering pictures on her website and among all her followers. We love Hillary just the way she is.

I imagine if I was married to Obama I'd want a Honda and he'd want a Toyota. I'd want PCs and he'd stick with a MAC. I'd want to eat on the east side of LA and he'd want to eat on the West side. At movies, I'd see what he missed and he'd laugh at what I'd see as obvious. Of course, we wouldn't be married because I'm too old, and I don't think he is all that interested in older women. So most of all I don't like him due to instinct, not reasoning: I see someone haughty who does not "come down" from his high horse. I see someone evasive. I see a taker, not a giver. But I could be all wrong about him; if she were not in the picture, I would feel much better about this young fellar. And if he were elected, maybe he'd get lucky in the years leading to 2012, and everything would be ok with him at the helm.

It's just a feeling I have that Hillary is mature and in her "generativity" stage, as Erik Erikson puts it, "gets" the spiritual source of life, and wants to heal America. He remains in his (Erik Erikson) young adulthood stage where he is still in search of fitting in and getting, finding, and keeping love. She is ready to return it. She is more advanced in life and ready. I want to look at HIllary working for the next 8 years. I want to hold her accountable. She inspires me to keep on going. So I dislike him because he is not Hillary.

When Hillary steps down and he knows where the heat switch is in the White House, he may have been by then the best Vice President the United States has ever known. He would be fully ready to become a historic President -- the one who will enjoy our emergent, new greatness after Hillary has gotten us out of harm's way and restored the dignity of democracy to America.

:D :) :cool: It's so emotional - :p and we who argue pretend it's so rational!!!! :confused: ;) :rolleyes:

Reese

03-09-2008, 10:04 PM

1. Many times I have heard BO say "We" (always with the Royal "We") "will make mistakes." AS IN - it's okay for him to make a mistake, but even his (false) allegation that Hillary made a mistake, if true would mean that HE may make a mistake but she may not!

2. If you haven't read her Senate floor speech regarding Iraq you should. I have an excerpt at the bottom. Still --try to go to her Senate web site and read the whole piece.

3. Joe Wilson (Valerie Plame Wilson's husband) wrote an excellent piece "Battle-Tested" on this topic. Read it, too, if you can.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/joe-wilson/battletested_b_86355.html?load=1&page=58

4. I agree with the vast majority of what has been written thus far. But allow me to add to the list:
Quoted from the New York Times - January 28, 2007 - by Jodi Kantor, Regarding Obama in law school:

”Barak Obama told the Associated Press: I’m not interested in the suburbs. The suburbs bore me.” Charming, huh?

5. As many have said, he is very slick about his attacks and unfortunately most people aren't tuned in closely enough to really think about what he is saying. He discounts and condescends to her and us with an arrogance that makes my blood boil. He expertly uses faulty logic (starting usually with a faulty premise) and inflammatory words to engage and persuade his audience. He takes listeners down a path that [I]sounds nice[I] then, strikes like a snake, then goes on for a "sweet" sounding, but twisted conclusion. (It is literally like a drug to some people.) This "skill" he has is precisely what gives politics a bad name.

When you couple this skill with the naiveté of youth and the need of many people to feel like they "belong" to a group and have a hero to lead them, you get a poisonous witches (warlock's) brew/kool-aid, whatever. Unfortunately the press/media has drank from the cup.

I'm sure as soon as I post this, I'll think of five or more additional reasons.

* WHAT HILLARY SAID ABOUT THE RESOLUTION TO AUTHORIZE FORCE AGAINST IRAQ
October 10, 2002: Floor Speech of Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton on S.J. Res. 45: “My vote is not, however, a vote for any new doctrine of pre-emption, or for uni-lateralism, or for the arrogance of American power or purpose -- all of which carry grave dangers for our nation, for the rule of international law and for the peace and security of people throughout the world. …I urge the President to spare no effort to secure a clear, unambiguous demand by the United Nations for unlimited inspections. …A vote for it is not a vote to rush to war; it is a vote that puts awesome responsibility in the hands of our President and we say to him - use these powers wisely and as a last resort.”

Laura Cereta

03-10-2008, 04:12 PM

Thanks for the compliment. I should hope that after spending about 1/4 of my lifetime at university that I developed a few writing skills!

LOL!!! Don't feel bad. I'm 29 and have been in school all but 5 years of my life from the time I was born (8 years in higher education and 2 more to go)! Don't get me wrong; education is a wonderful privilege, and I'm grateful for it, but I'm literally on the 30-year-plan.

Laura Cereta

03-10-2008, 04:21 PM

I don't support BO for President for too many reasons to list (I could pretty much reduce it to "What they said..."), but the main reason is the most important to me:

I don't feel he's capable of, or willing to, always uphold the Constitution of the United States and keep this countries' citizens safe from harm. He's shown no evidence in his resume, character, or choice of associations to convince me otherwise.

Peppermint Patty

03-10-2008, 09:15 PM

And there are so many others as well. For the life of me I do not get this charisma that his passionate followers see. It really is like a trance. And the nastiness of his followers is disgusting and juvenile. I do think he incites and inspires those people to go off the deep end.

As they say here in Hollywood, (cleaned up for a PG audience, however :o)

The heck with you and the horse you rode in on, NObama!

lanney

03-10-2008, 10:15 PM

No experience, created by media, I think media will bring him down. I just waiting some scandal will come out.
Lets see whether woman or money will bring him down.

TeejDee

03-10-2008, 10:43 PM

I was and am a great fan of Margaret Thatcher. I lived in England when she was elected and was in office. It was not an easy campaign for her either and seemed against all odds. Hillary reminds me of her in many ways.

I read a quote of Maggie's which applies to Hillary and Obama today.

" THE COCK MAY CROW LOUDER, BUT ITS THE HEN WHO LAYS THE EGGS".

Her experience and knowledge and strength will ensure her success to the Whitehouse.

CGP

03-10-2008, 11:05 PM

Les33

03-10-2008, 11:15 PM

To me, he's someone so insubstantial he's barely there. He has no convictions, no courage of his convictions, no integrity to stand up for anything possibly at odds with anything else. He enhances himself with half-truths and outright lies to fabricate a nebulous "presence" he can show to the world. Personally, I'm most offended by his "misguided youth" posture, having lived through many desperately lost years and paid serious dues of my own. His attempt to capitalize on a wayward past (which proves to be closer to scouthood when examined) to impress his young followers makes me more than mad. He has 2 of the character traits I least admire (seemingly in great abundance): arrogance, phoniness.

G4Hillary

03-11-2008, 07:22 AM

Obama is an old fashioned style dirty Chicago politician that knows how to do one thing well, i.e. lie.

emmyCA

03-11-2008, 07:55 AM

His name scares me 1, his face scares me twice, his speech scares me thousand times...Not to mention, his wife disgusts me whenever she opens her mouth..

Jen the Michigander

03-11-2008, 10:56 PM

When this presidential race began, I didn't feel strongly about Obama one way or the other. I was willing to give him a chance, the same as all the other candidates. His "change" speeches didn't dazzle me the way they have dazzled so many others. Still, I adopted a wait and see approach so I could determine what exactly he stood for. But then Obama took his name off the ballot for the Michigan primary. That's when I realized that Obama's talk about change was (and is) nothing but talk. When he had an opportunity to take a stand and go against the establishment, he did exactly what the establishment wanted him to do. And the DNC has rewarded him for it.

Since then, Obama has said and done other things that confirmed my decision not to vote for him. But it all started when he took his name off the ballot in Michigan. That was the deal breaker for me.

B positive

03-11-2008, 11:09 PM

FLUFF in Nevada: "I can get Hillary's supporters to vote for me, but I don't think she can get mine to vote for her!"

B POSITIVE's thoughts: Sen. Obama is such a newbie... he knows not what he says.

FLUFF the day after SuperTues: "I am sure that I can get Hillary's supporters to vote for me but I don't think she can say the same about mine."

B POSITIVE's thoughts: All of the big blue states had a choice and they didn't choose you, FLUFF. Your comments are divisive and you've lost any chance of my vote!

From that day on, it was Hillary in November... no matter what!

JamieKuuipo

03-11-2008, 11:35 PM

He never turned me on. He is off, like mentaly off.

I agree with all the above reasons: every thing is off about him.
He's no president, Hes not even human.

movingtous

03-12-2008, 01:03 AM

I am a born again free thinker, and I cannot stand to watch Obama talk. I always feel like I'm back in church.:eek::eek:

emmyCA

03-12-2008, 05:18 AM

He denied his middle name

emmyCA

03-12-2008, 05:21 AM

He never turned me on. He is off, like mentaly off.

I agree with all the above reasons: every thing is off about him.
He's no president, Hes not even human.

I like this, yes, he couldn never turn me on...no need to turn me off, I already off.:D

CGP

03-12-2008, 11:21 PM

So much to add to my original list of 11 turn-offs....

Dendy

03-12-2008, 11:50 PM

Everything.

CGP

03-12-2008, 11:51 PM

OBAMA TROLLS!

HIS SUPPORTERS!

jgilmore

03-14-2008, 01:49 AM

I am so glad I found this forum. Until now I have just been on the Democratic Party blog driving the Obama supporters crazy. I was like many of you. For Hillary for years and years. Just waiting for her to take the plunge into the race. But what alerted me to Obama first was his hypocrisy. He preached bringing people together, building coalitions, yet belonged to the Afrocentrist church. It just really bothered me. Why would somebody belong to a church that they didn't believe in? I felt from the beginning that he because of this background, he needed many years on the public stage to frankly have the public see if he could be trusted. At this point I could never vote for him. What makes the Obama people crazy is when I talk about voting for McCain if Obama gets this nomination. I tell them I have to try to save the party from itself. If Obama gets in their and fails miserably, it may be decades before we can elect a good Democrat.

Tea toaD

03-15-2008, 02:50 PM

Early on, he really didn't think he had a chance. His name, inexperience and so on. As time went by he started to catch on with speeches that were elegant and smooth. While all this was happening, Hillary was being bashed and called names while he was being praised for "his speeches and how he attracts large audiences because of them). Soon, I realized that he had no reason being a president. To run the most powerful country in the world just because he speaks well. He was a community leader and a senator. Lot's of superficial things that do not matter. Then the media promoting him just because they are so anti-Hillary. I guess I could go on and on. But I really did want to have faith in him if Hillary didn't get the nod. But too many negative qualities:(

Ijane

03-16-2008, 12:12 AM

As of today, I only know a little about Obama's ideas. At this point, I strongly believe that the reason I (and everyone else) know so little about Obama's position on the issues is because that's the Obama campaign strategy. I'm not comfortable with a man whose 'celebrity appeal' allows him to advance as far as he has without ever having to state his position on virtually anything. It's very dishonest and it's even more scary.

Thanks to Rolling Stones magazine, I know that Obama voted with conservatives on tort reform and industry-friendly provisions in the bankruptcy bill. He introduced a troop-pullout bill for the Iraq war but he was late with it and it was no good. I know he voted against the state version of the BAIPA bill (the Born Alive Infants Protection Act ) when he was state senator even though the federal version passed through the senate (in 2002)with a unanimous vote. Senators Kennedy, Clinton, and Kerry ALL voted on it. The Act finally passed in Illinois in 2005, only after Obama left. Michelle Obama was also very against BAIPA. If you don't know about BAIPA, google it. It's not even about right to life/pro-choice. It may shed a little light on the Obama's extreme tendencies. I'm offended by the thought that what little information I know about Obama is probably more then what most of his supporters know about him.

I'm offended by the Obama's preaching "change and hope" while running a campaign that's so mean spirited that it's polarized the Democratic party. I'm mortified that the Obama campaign has used the Clinton infidelities as a weapon against Hillary. It's been used by Michelle Obama, rev. Wright and even again this past Friday by a top Obama campaign person.

It mortified me when Michelle Obama recently used Chelsea Clinton's Hedge fund job as a dig against Hillary. Michelle has turned out to be a very conniving person but she probably thinks she's clever.

Obama told Jeremiah Wright that he wouldn’t be able to give the public prayer at Obama’s 2007 campaign kick-off. He told Wright that the public wouldn’t like it and it would hurt his campaign. Instead, Obama met in private with Wright for a prayer just prior to the kick off. How does that fit into a 'hope and change' campaign?

I can honestly say that I was always a Democrat first and a Hillary Clinton supporter second. This means that even though I believe Hillary would make the best President, in the end, i'd vote for the winner of the Democratic primary. It makes me very sad to say that if Obama should win, I won't vote during the presidential elections. There's no way I'd vote for McCain and I couldn't in good conscience vote for Obama. Sorry for the rambling post but I really needed to vent!

Teri B.

03-16-2008, 01:16 AM

First, it was his supporters. They freak me out they're so rabid and obsessed.

Second, it was the media constantly saying she was "attacking" him, while he was constantly going after her from the start. Does anyone even remember those early debates when he and Edwards were all over her, and she didn't even fight back, because she was so far ahead?

Third, the more I researched him, the more disturbing information I found: Rezko, Exelon, his "present" votes in Illinois, his MTP interview where he said he didn't know how he would have voted on the Iraq resolution, his being a carbon copy of Gov. Patrick, etc.

Fourth, the cornerstone of his campaign being some speech he gave in 2002. I mean, I was against that vote, does that mean I should be president? Of course, I didn't have the responsibility either. Half the senators endorsing him made the same vote Hillary did for the same reasons. Every time he says his judgment is superior to hers, he's also saying it's superior to Rockefeller, Biden, Edwards, Cleland, Dashel, Schumer, and on and on, and that's just the senators. It's arrogant and it's bull.

And most importantly, I don't get what his plan is for all this "hope" and "change." Inspiration is great, but we are in 2 wars, the economy is tanking, our civil rights are up for grabs, and our standing in the world is at an all time low. I want someone in the White House who KNOWS how to make changes, not just HOPES he can.

Sherry

03-16-2008, 01:58 AM

I was never turned on.

ActionJackson

03-16-2008, 11:44 PM

"I originally submitted this list to the Democratic Underground Forum before they banned me for being too pro-Hillary and too anti-Obama! Over there it's actually Obama Underground and Hillary supporters are pretty much despised despite the fact it's meant to be a mixed forum. "

Why is this happening? Like 2004 again?

This is what turned me off of Obama. To be honest though, I was always for Hillary. But I liked Obama and now I DO NOT !!!!

He has been horrible to women (I am one).
His supporters have ripped older women apart (I am one).
He has stolen every idea of Hillary's and presented it like he had the greatest of ideas.
He is a fraud.
He has no experience.

He had no right to run and imperil her candidacy. He should have gotten some experience in the Senate and ran in 4-8 years.

He let's the media favor him and he divides our party, our country then points to others and calls them dividers.

Whatever accusation comes out of him about Hillary--we need to look at him. Whatever he is/does he accuses her of it.

I am certain that he is part of the Republican playbook... his supporters are ready to shut down any discourse, debate, any comment or opinion that doesn't adore Obama... this is just like when no one could say anything about Bush in 2004 election. He plans to vamp up his attacks on HIllary by questioning her integrity, honesty, transparency to divert attention from the discrepancies between what he has said about Rezko in the past, and what he said about him Friday; he wants to divert attention from his minister's racism by calling Hillary's campaign racist.

John Grisham wrote The Appeal-- that industry that want's to protect it's interests will
promote an UNKNOWN POLITICIAN over a well-known, career politician sure to be elected, by creating an image of the well-known politician as being an ideologue. Sound familiar?

So what industry does Hillary threaten that the entire media is in cohoots, and all teh internet blogs (Daily Kos, too)? Dagonit, I thought we were getting rid of the Bush BS.

Charlie Brown

03-17-2008, 12:05 AM

In the beginning I was a Biden supporter. I have admired Joe biden for years. he is so prepared for the international affairs. After watching the first debate it was clear who the leader was. Hillary Clinton, I still think Joe deserved a better shot and was ignored by the media in the debates. But Hillary was so clear on what she will do. As for BO he never impressed me. I didnt pay him much attention, untill I had no choice, BECAUSE the media never shut up about him. Now I hate that man more then I hate Bush. I didnt think that was possible. I can hardly bare to watch BO. he is a phoney. With the resent scandle I am really worried he will distroy this country if he is elected. BUt I dont see how it will happen. mcCain will win if Bo gets in.

david m

03-17-2008, 12:56 AM

welcome!

HillBuzzBlogspotCom

03-17-2008, 02:24 AM

http://hillbuzz.blogspot.com/2008/03/rejected-titles-for-barack-obamas.html#links

Because Obama finds Jeremiah Wright's sermons so inspiring, there are limitless titles for new Obama books to be found in Wright's inspirational speeches!

BooskerD

03-17-2008, 10:34 AM

lea210

03-18-2008, 07:31 AM

1. The Iraq war. He keeps saying he never voted for the war, but DUH, you weren't in the senate to vote. Also, the whole quote in July 27, 2004 Chicago Tribune as saying, "There's not that much difference between my position and George Bush's position at this stage." He has been flip flopping, yet the public thinks he actually VOTED against it, period. They don't know the truth yet.

2. He voted against a cap on credit card interest rates

3. He just doesn't vote, period. LOL. He has voted present on hundreds of Bills. He is also not really bipartisan yet that is what he claims to want to do. Google: Obama: A Thin Record For a Bridge Builder. Finally he said, he accidentally pushed the wrong button when voting.

4. His wife is just, well I don't want to use profanity, but she is just dumb. She wrote a college thesis about how Americans are sloths, without souls,and white people are always out to get black people. She is also just NOW proud to be an American, and said she would have to consider on voting for Hillary, even if she wins the dem. nomination. Oh she also implied that Black people supporting Hillary are sleeping and will eventually wake up and vote for a black candidate. (interview in youtube)

5. Michelle Obama worked for Treehouse. Treehouse is the supplier of Walmart. Obama scolded Hillary on walmart, and walmart itself, yet his wife was making a lot of money supplying it. She quit her Job when Obama decided to run for president. (look at http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/05/13/wobama13.xml )

6. He uses the race card. However, he does it indirectly that his followers do not see it. By using the race card, he turned a lot of African Americans away from Hillary.

7. He is arrogant

8. The rezko dealings. He went from I don't know him, to I know OF him, to I did know him and I got $150,000 in campaign money, and recently said Oh it was really $250,000

9. His dealings with Exelon

10. His crazy pastor and separatist church. His pastor giving a lifetime achievement award to Ferrakhan.

11. The media bias towards him is disgusting. They have been rooting for him to win, just because they want a "story."

12. He keeps saying he takes no lobbyist money, but he does. (google obama's money cartel)

13. He tries to bastardize Hillary's experience, yet he has NONE at all. His accomplishments is literally just sponsoring bills and occassionally voting. The end.

14. He is a different person to different people. In Iowa he was "white" because of his mom and supports corn-based ethanol energy? (Iowa=corn=pandering). In the south he is "black"using MLK tone and lines, and going to black churches, etc. In the North he is biracial and son of a white woman from Kansas.

15. He is anti-universal healthcare

16. His usage of Oprah to sway voters

17. His lame celebrity, yes we can, music video.

18. Naftagate- He completely denied it. Then said it was only his professor. Then after a Confirmed MEMO is found, he admits it's his advisor who talked with the Canadians. Then his supporters are trying to spread the false rumor that it was in fact hillary who contacted Canada, yet the prime minister and Canadian press all deny it. (plus no evidence, like Barack's memo)

19. He plans to disarm the U.S. Defense system

20. He did drugs and dealed drugs (and college students/potheads think it's cool)

21. He always plays the victim card. Whenever Hillary or the media brings questions to his records or past, his response is always something like "She is attacking me because she is desperate *chuckkles*" Then when he is asked to elaborate on an issue that HIllary brings up, he laughs, denies, then changes the subject.

22. He used passages of his speeches from Deval. Not just paraphrase, but whole passages were used.

23. He has no record of accomplishing anything significant. His followers also do not know what he has done, but blindy follows him to join the bandwagon. He is supposedly the hip new guy with speeches, while Hillary is supposedly the experience, but old white lady.

24. Many of his supporters are literally in denial of his flaws and accused Hillary of anything anti-Obama. They also think he has runned a honest and clean campaign, and any form of smear is solely Hillary.

lea210

03-18-2008, 07:35 AM

Lodi

03-18-2008, 10:26 AM

My instincts have rebelled against this man from the outset. He struck me as a poseur: insincere, someone who doesn't walk his talk. He's arrogant and smug and has no original plans devised to address the problems facing this country. And now we come to find (or have our feelings verified) that his judgment is very bad indeed.

NOBAMA, NO WAY!

JOY TO THE WORLD

03-18-2008, 11:12 AM

Found this excellent commentary that believe you will find interesting about the relationship of Obama and Rev Wright.

http://www.postchronicle.com/commentary/article_212136485.shtml#share

Hillary for President :):)

Cooney

03-18-2008, 11:22 AM

hillary1

03-18-2008, 01:11 PM

In addition to the things I posted earlier, I have to say that his supporters have really gotten to me. A more irrational, foul-mouthed lot I could never hope to find. In a local online forum, someone actually posted a thread entitled "Hillary can kiss my a**"! The author stresses that as dems, we must all pull together and support whoever wins the nomination....he then goes on to refer to Hillary supporters as "menopausal mannequins" whose only goal is to "get somebody of their own gender in the white house." The thread goes on with page after page of misogynist language and references until if finally occurred to me that the people writing were all males and terrified that somebody not of their own gender might gain the highest office in the land. I don't want to sound like an idiot, but it's the first time it actually occurred to me that a huge portion of guys might be supporting Obama because they can't stand the idea of a woman president. It was shocking to see the hate and vitriol in those posts.:eek:

i agree whole heartdly with your response, and most men will not come to terms with a woman as president, it is the same as if you were to engage in a conversation about gay men, i truly believe that most men feel very insecure with their masculinity, having thoughts fly through their heads are that they also may be gay, so they respond to it by being pugnacious, arrogant to mask what really may be a deep underlying message

if it were to endose obama who stated this morning, after stating that "he did not know", now he reverses his statement, that "i confess that if all that i kenw of rev.wright were the snippets, i would have reacted in a different way", but thinking this and sitting in the first pew nodding your head in agreement to the hatred and racists remarks does not make sound "judgement as he preaches" to rectify or correct problems, now you want me to vote for you, a man who is tied at the hip with the hatred spewed from this man's mouth, and all you can say is, "you were inspired" by him,

I WILL VOTE FOR HILLARY, IF SHE DOES NOT GET THE NOMINATION, I WILL VOTE, CONTRIBUTE AND DO ALL THAT I CAN TO HELP JOHN MCCAIN GET THE NOD

WE MAY NOT LIKE WHAT MACCAIN STANDS FOR, BUT AT LEAST HE IS HONEST WITH HIS PEOPLE, AND I HAVEN'T HEARD ANY WORDS OF HATRED FROM A MAN WHO SUFFERED AT THE HANDS OF HIS ENEMY

SO MUCH FOR OBAMA'S WORD 'JUDGEMENT', FLIP FLOPPING AGAIN

Area504

03-18-2008, 01:31 PM

I was leery from the start.

I actually liked him very much when I heard him speak at the Dem Convention in '04. I would have considered voting for him, but then I learned about his affiliation with Rev. Wright and the Trinity UCC maybe a year ago or more through an article I read online in the Chicago Tribune. I hadn't seen the videos we all saw last week, but I did check out the Trinity UCC website (which has been scrubbed considerably since that time).

That did it for me, and the stuff in your list was icing on the cake!

BooskerD

03-18-2008, 02:10 PM

I actually liked him very much when I heard him speak at the Dem Convention in '04. I would have considered voting for him, but then I learned about his affiliation with Rev. Wright and the Trinity UCC maybe a year ago or more through an article I read online in the Chicago Tribune. I hadn't seen the videos we all saw last week, but I did check out the Trinity UCC website (which has been scrubbed considerably since that time).

That did it for me, and the stuff in your list was icing on the cake!

You know, rumors of his church have been floating around for well over a year. I was appalled when I looked at their website- were the language reversed and were this a "white" church, folks would be screaming racism! I'll check back and see if they've cleaned up their site since I last looked at it. I'm certain there's been a bit of "house-keeping" since this video clip has made the news.

CGP

03-18-2008, 02:11 PM

You know this may sound strange or hokie, but I have always had a keen sense of people's character. Call it a sixth sense, I call it "thin slicing" their body language, but anyhoo, I can usually tell a persons true self way before it ever shows. Sometime, I don't find out the true self for a very long time sometimes days, but I am usually right. I get a real unease with Obama, he is not what he projects, and I think my insight is now earning it's stripes again. Call it women's intution, keen observance, I don't know what, but I am old and I have been right too many times for me not to pay attention to that little voice that tells me something different than the big volume coming in. That leads me of course to investigate, and that lead me to not overlook the negative about him, and certainly not fall for the hype.

I know exactly what you mean. In addition to the many substantive reasons I have for not supporting Obama, there is also this final one you mention - a gut feeling, intuition...I am confident in my ability to judge someone's character and to do so without bias. My judgment of Obama's character yields a distinctly negative result. I sense fraudulence and dishonesty.

BooskerD

03-18-2008, 02:17 PM

I know exactly what you mean. In addition to the many substantive reasons I have for not supporting Obama, there is also this final one you mention - a gut feeling, intuition...I am confident in my ability to judge someone's character and to do so without bias. My judgment of Obama's character yields a distinctly negative result. I sense fraudulence and dishonesty.

Same here...in addition to the multitudinous obvious reasons for not trusting him, I also have this "gut" feeling that all is not well with him- and I know after all these years that those feelings are always correct.

CGP

03-21-2008, 02:54 PM

I think "part 2" of my original posting must be just about due!!!!

ALL4HILLARY

03-21-2008, 03:02 PM

wasGOPnowInd

03-21-2008, 03:21 PM

Great quote - good signature line for anyone daring to use it! ;)

The quote was posted by TeeJDee from Margaret Thatcher: "The cock may crow louder, but it is the hen who lays the eggs!"

I just added it to mine!

As for me, as a business woman, I am tired of more experienced women being denied the opportunities and promotions, watching them go to slick talking, inexperienced men - just because they can stand up to pee!

That is not my only reason, it is just one of many.

foreigner4hillary

03-21-2008, 03:35 PM

My primary reason for not liking him is pretty simple. I'm a skeptical cynic or a cynical skeptic...hmm.

I don't buy stuff based on what the manufacturer claims it can do...especially when it sounds too good to be true!

Hope and change. Pfft.

Aren't you americans the one who came up with the term "SHOW ME THE MONEY!!" :p

Dendy

03-21-2008, 03:46 PM

He never turned me on to begin with.
I’m perplexed when Hearing and reading all this high praises of his eloquence and leadership. But then I have to remind myself that this is still the same country that elected G.W. Bush in 2000.
I don’t trust the guy; it’s in my gut that everything he says is calculated and insincere to the core. You can see his insincerity just by observing him on the out site, the way he interacts with people, lifts his chin up all the instances where he snubbed Hillary.
And then we have all the behind the scenes dirt tricks he and his campaign pulled on Hillary. The accusations, the race the double-faced I’m the messiah and she’s the devil massage.
There is simply nothing I like about the guy.

mooaks

03-21-2008, 05:25 PM

I don't care for Obama, never have from the beginning. Not because of his color, but because he was standing in the way of my presidential preference Hillary Clinton. I began to get really discouraged when he started reeling off all of those victories, before Hillary could break through in Texas, Ohio, and Rhode Island.

In the mean time I watched and listened to each debate and found that he was very arrogant. Remember when he was mocking Hillary about his using just words and was plagiarizing. He mockingly laughed and said that he recently gave two speeches and before he followed up on the two speeches, he commented with a smile, that they were pretty good. Arrogance personified.

Because she was falling behind with all of his recent successes after super Tuesday, I thought I'd better try to find out just what this guy is really all about. I went to a few Chicago newspaper sites and became suspicious about his Rezko connections. Then found information about all of those legislative accomplishments of his. Almost all of them were handed to him to help get them passed and had been worked on for years by others who felt that O'bamas way with words might work across the isle to pass them. They passed but did not give any credit to those who worked for years on the legislature, but rather took all of the credit. Also stating to one in particular that The thing would not have passed with out him. Real Uniter.

Then this Pastor Wright story broke and I must confess, I enjoyed the hell out of it. He just acted like he was so clean until he got taken down a notch, maybe ten notches? I want him out of the way of Hillary period.

I have always believed that when you apply for a high position in business, that experience does count and when Obama is so dismissive of Hillary with that fact, I disliked him even more.

There are other reasons, I don't care for Kerry and Kennedy, two losers, who endorsed him, I thought they were turncoats, however I was tickled when she won Mass.

As far as her mandate for Universal health care goes, I had an up-close-and personal with that issue, when I attended a meeting on Part D (Prescription Drug part of Medicare) meeting.

I didn't think it was fair to penalize me because I didn't sign on when it first became available. I felt that I would go to Canada for my drugs if my health should take a turn for the worse.

I approached the lady and told her about the unfairness of my having to be forced to sign up or pay the one percent penalty imposed for not doing so.
SHE TOLD ME EXACTLY WHAT HILLARY HAS BEEN SAYING ABOUT MANDATES AN HER UNIVERSAL HEALTH CARE PROGRAM.

We have to mandate that everyone sick or healthy sign up with some plan or it just wouldn't work. The same applies to Social Security, Medicare, and Hillary's Universal Health Care plan. We have to have everyone on board or it just would not work. She did not say that she would garnishee wages; however that could be an option.

At any rate, I do have more reasons, but primarily I love Hillary Clinton. As a person she is caring, smart as a whip, a great listener, generous, warm, outgoing. Hillary Clinton is just a unbelievable person and I want her for my president so badly that I think that anyone who does not consider her for the top job in the land after checking her solutions to the problems facing all of us today are just plain stupid. Excuse me for saying it but it comes from the heart.

Soaring Eagle

03-21-2008, 05:28 PM

I quite simply could sense early on that Obama was a divider and a LIAR! Besides that i have been for Hillary from DAY ONE! There is no substitute for the best!

Alessandro Machi

03-21-2008, 06:43 PM

If Bush was bad and most democrats think Bill Clinton's tenure was good, then changing from Bush means going towards Clinton. Well, we have that chance.

I think Obama has disrespected the Clinton legacy by trying to lump it with the Bush record.

In head to head competition in ALL STATES that held statewide elections rather than caucuses, Hillary is leading Obama approximately 255 electoral college votes to approximately 155 electoral college votes for Obama.

Hillary has won 8 of the 10 biggest electoral college states in the country.

Obama's explanation and defense of his minister was philosophically bankrupt.

If Superdelegates are supposed to vote the will of the state, then shouldn't caucuses, that represent just a fraction of the state's population, do the same?

Carolyn

03-21-2008, 06:58 PM

Before the Iowa caucuses, the Big Zero was quoted as saying that black voters were just waiting for some sign that he was electable, then they would flock to his campaign in droves. After winning in Iowa, but particularly after then LOSING in New Hampshire (where women voters propelled Hillary to victory following his "she's likeable enough" remark, and the media's derisive response to her tears welling up), it was suddenly advantageous for him to morph into the "black" candidate. The subtle race-baiting began. His campaign circulated the memo implying Hillary was racist for making the LBJ/MLK remark. They jumped all over Bill, all holier-than-thou, criticizing him and Hillary for playing the race card. That's when I started to sour on him. What a santimonious phony. As his campaign gained momentum, his supporters became increasingly -- you should forgive the term -- cocky, arrogant, abusive to Hillary, nakedly sexist, all the while preaching hope and unity and harmony. She was "shrill," "power-hungry," too emotional, not emotional enough. Ug. "You must be the change you wish to see in the world"? I don't think so. Events of the past month have not improved my impression. The attacks on Geraldine Ferraro -- more race-baiting. I lost a brother to HIV, and the idea that Obama did not publically condemn Wright's outrageous assertions about AIDS until it became politically expedient to do so was beyond shocking to me, never mind all of Wright's other hateful rhetoric. And then the sermon on race. It had powerful moments, to be sure, but he lost me when he said, "We can dismiss Reverend Wright as a crank or a demagogue, just as some have dismissed Geraldine Ferraro, in the aftermath of her recent statements, as harboring some deep-seated racial bias." Huh? Did he just put those two people in the same sentence? Wasn't that YOU, Senator, who expressed outrage and indignation about her remarks, fully one week after they were made, and on the day before the Mississippi primary? Enough!

Bless

03-21-2008, 07:08 PM

Before: his inexperience
Now: his Dishonesty and Tendency to divide the country

leahchamblee

03-21-2008, 07:12 PM

Joe from WI

03-22-2008, 10:24 AM

I was trying to ignore it. I was for Hillary but not rabidly so, my few comments on I'm for Hillary being met with accusations was a bit scary enough. But what tossed me totally into the fray was Obama's unconcern for his grandma and NPR's speculation on how every white person out there has a racist grandma or grandpa hiding in their closets. No...not my grandma.

NOT MY GRANDMA

Let me ask this question : how can someone who is racist raise her grandson with the best she had, gave him the best education and willing to shoulder the responsibilities of a parent (when both parents have abandoned him)??

I honestly believe BO's granny loved him dearly. She isnt racist in any way.

And I can also honestly tell you. In front of live television, if you can use your granny to sidestep or deflect criticisms of your own mistakes, it demonstrates EXACTLY WHAT KIND OF PERSON YOU ARE : UNTRUSTYWORTHY, INGRATE and UNSCRUPULOUS. BO claims he has integrity. BS. I can tell you. BO WILL OUT AMERICA because he has no qualms selling out his one and only granny who loved him and raised him with the best she can give for him.

carmaken

03-22-2008, 02:22 PM

I was willing to give him a chance, at first. I had watched and loosely followed him since that address to the Democratic National Convention in 2004.

But he kept attacking Hillary on her original vote for the war. Back when she voted to go to war, he was NOT a member of the US Senate. He had no authority to vote. So his opinion re: being against the war was basically the same as any of us. Only the members of the House and the Senate had the right to actually vote for or against the war. He has no right to attack her for this.
And the year before she had watched 3,000 Americans die in her own state on 9/11.

Then I was in Nevada during their caucuses. I was actually out their watching a new grandbaby for several wks. and decided to get online to both campaign websites. His was rife with hatred for her. The people on there were rude and obnoxious and would allow nothing positive to be said about her. I was struck as a lifetime Democrat that we should not be so hateful. Aren't we supposed to be basically on the same side of things? (Her website carefully monitored each posting to make sure it stayed positive.)
He won't get my vote now.

Engelfried

03-29-2008, 11:41 PM

I was leery from the start.
4. Obama has stated that he will recognize and work with "rogue governments". Bad idea.

6. Sleazy dealings with Tony Rezko. Wouldn't be amazed if he ends up being indicted at some point.

I hate that the media has thus far handled Obama with kid gloves. I hate how attacks on Hillary are of such a personal nature. Bottom line, I don't trust Obama. Call it female intuition or whatever...I get a very bad feeling about him.

I take slight exception to number four. Both Hillary's and Obama's positions with regards to foreign diplomacy are valid. Hillary is putting forward more professionalism than the last eight years of Bush while Obama is pushing a more open form of diplomacy. Each reflects the personalities of each other.

My problems with Obama revolve more around his advisors. Since he was unable to do anyting in the 6 of 7 years in Illinois because of recalcitrant Republicans, so you can't farily blame him for his state years. However, rushed through a bunch of "liberal" votes in Washington and didn't hold a single meeting of his subcommittee, means his choice of his closest advisors becomes more pronounced.

First, on economics, which David Cutler and Jeffrey Liebman are largely responsible for. They both push for market-based solutions for everything, including garnishing paychecks and sending that directly to Wall Street firms to "solve" the SS crisis through a partial-privatization scheme. While Obama hasn't put this forward, the fact these two have his ear is problematic and stands in direct opposition of his professed "liberalism". This is also why I think he "flipflopped" with NAFTAgate and why his economic response to the looming credit crisis was so remarkably Republican in nature early in February that it could have almost been confused with McCain's.

His other prominent celebrity advisor disaster was Samantha Power, who is essentially an apologist for American-backed genocides and who many on the hard left can't stand. Just like Obamabots, there are many people who have been suckered in by her. She spent half a book talking about Kosovo but fails to even mention East Timor, or Nixon's bombing campaigns which enabled the Khmer Rouge to ascend to power in Cambodia, etc. She's even said in an LA Times article in 2003 that even if the Iraq war was for the wrong reason, and the US was already there, the US might as well take advantage of the situation! It's like saying the cops illegally entered your house, but since they were there, they might as well look for drugs. To me, she comes across as a person who would get the US involved in MORE foreign military entanglements, not less, and based on her shallow interpretation of "human rights".

I think she is the reason why Obama had become so soft on Iraq. She had his ear and managed to convince him to "stay the course" in Iraq, simply so the US can bring justice to the sectarian warlords responsible for much of the violence. I think this shows that Obama may be too easily swayed by others around him. Cutler, Power, Wright, to name a few and maybe illustrate a pattern.

It's one thing to take input, quite another to fold.

If he can be made to contort around his position on Iraq, imagine how he could be manipulated into partial privatization of Social Security like his advisors may be pushing him to do after his election.

samkm

03-31-2008, 02:17 PM

What turned me off Obama:
My own realization of what has been well captured in below:
Obama's Laundry List of Lies: http://worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=60325

What pulled me strongly towards Hillary:
And a visit to www.thehillaryiknow.com which give me a stark contrast on what I had been missing and sorely needed to find in the President for so long. And some of the other links below including veterans endorsement and highschoolers endorsement which captures her solutions (www.hillaryclinton.com/issues) very well in a video.

MAN4u

03-31-2008, 02:31 PM

The very things that have turned you off to Obama have also turned me off to him. Those and the disturbing politics of Rev. Wright. This was a pastor of the church that BO attended for years and he's just now noticing the racism? Give me a break. By the way, love the signature line.

CGP

03-31-2008, 02:32 PM

Moved back to main room as this is a "hot topic"!

Imwithhillary

03-31-2008, 02:38 PM

CGP

04-02-2008, 05:36 AM

I was initially offended by his gaul to run for President as an untested, inexperienced newcomer to national politics. It didn't take me long to see through his facade to the arrogant, cunning, derivative, hypocritical political hack that he is. I saw The Music Man, Elmer Gantry and Jim Jones rolled up in one unappealing package.

And clearly he's had the backing of the big wigs in the DNC to get him to this point. And to think he (and his campaign) would have the AUDACITY to prevent himself as the non-establishment candidate!!??

smsemedic

04-02-2008, 06:15 AM

i would have to say that ONE of the first items that told me "no to obama" would be his stand on healthcare... the fact that he voted "present" some 130+ times really bothered me, his flip-flopping on issues, and the fact that he never seemed to have an idea of his own. i did not see leadership skills at all! i was not drawn as others have been by his charisma...not at all. NOW, my reasons have been added to numerous times!!! the man is not to be trusted!!

superradmom

04-02-2008, 11:16 AM

I have been for Hillary from the beginning and in her corner since 92.

I became anti-BO after South Carolina when it became about race and they went after bill. the media

PolitikaFreedom

04-02-2008, 08:12 PM

I agree with all your reason that is why i will never vote for him plus to mention he is to cocky thinks he knows it all to in experienced. Think i fear for this country if he gets elected in i thought Bush was bad. :eek:

Comet, I laughed out loud! A Nervous, I know what you mean type of laugh. Obama is diiscusting, he knows himself less than bush so he would get us into worse of a crisis. McCaine Scares me too, as he seems very anti gay, anti choice, anti fiscal responsibility, anti anything that is not oil, war, money, or christian. Hillary is realyl the best choice! The only CHOICE! I don't want her to pick Edwards if he's going to sell out to Barack for a cool 10K too. I don't want Edwards b/c he has not backed Hillary up when he needs to or when he should have! That to me is a slap in the face! I think Edwards has jello inside his balls, enough said. I want Hillary to win!

I despise Obama's behaviors and personality for all the reasons mentioned on this site. Thanks Murry for starting this site and contributing to the conversation Hillary is having with us all! This is one of my favorite posts, and I plan on making notes from it. I have a friend in NY who considers herself the most brilliant brain, the truest vision (yes it gets annoying sometimes, as she also has a need from time to time to prove herself with me, especially with Barack) and she supports barack b/c she read his books and she is inspired by him and believes he can heal the racism in our nation!
I feel like *%^*^*&*&* her sometimes.

it would be nice to see some of you on YouTube in obama troll territory spamming and giving thumbs down to them and plus thumbs to Hillary supporters. We can be more visible on you tube, a it is scanned by the media moguls, etc. i am blocked on Yotube by some obama trolls, who work for you tube (highly illegal) But I still say it how i see it, without holding back. I lived 15 years in New York F'ken City : ) and we don not "play" with our time or words there. I like that about NY'rkers. More VISIBILITY ON UTUBE please!
I love you people as you are the one's who see the truth! HILLARY WILL WIN! Let's do this!

johnny51981

04-02-2008, 08:15 PM

In order to be "turned off" one must have been "on" in the beginning.

I've always wanted Hillary to be our President. In the beginning I was thinking, "Well, if Barrack gets it then I'll vote for him." Nu-uh....not no more "brotha".

The feelings I get when I see him and hear him speak (read as "repeat Hillary's statements") just bug me because I feel that he is looking out for his own rather than for all of America.

Clearly he isn't for giving everyone what they need, his Medical Policy is one clear example of that.

blueskygal

04-04-2008, 11:23 AM

The biggest one of all for me is his silence about the sexism and hatred that is directed Hillary's way by the press, pundits, establishment dems, and his supporters.. As a black person, he should be super sensitive to this. It shows his complete lack of moral values and ethics (as well as declaring unborn innocents "punishments to their parents."

This guy's god is himself.

blueskygal

04-04-2008, 12:26 PM

Has anyone noticed his total disdain for Bill Clinton's accomplishments as president? In my opinion, President Clinton was one of the best presidents of the 20th Century.

YES! The reason he is disdaining it is twofold: this man has NEVER accomplished anything (and if he did he cheated) and he CAN"T ADMIT Bill had a great presidency because this would work against him.

He is arrogant to the nines claiming the benefits of the civil rights movement and showing NO RESPECT for those who worked in it. He uses his own people.

he is a user period. and a first class narcissist just like Bush. That is why people want him in the white house because narcissists can be manipulated. you just appeal to their vanity. he showed no gratitude towards the white people who raised him and saw that he got a good education. instead he thew his grandma under the bus. he is a whiner of the first class. as well as his wife. they've had more priviledge than most of us and still it isn't enough. what prima donnas!

Joe from WI

04-04-2008, 01:26 PM

Dont even get me started! His willingess to play the race card and blame america when he doesnt take responsibilities p**d me off! That sealed it.

I cant stand his face; i cant even stand looking at his back!!

Patricia GA

04-05-2008, 08:11 PM

I could never vote for ticket with Obama on it. I agree with all the good points you have listed here. If Hillary wins the nomination I pray she does not get pressured into picking Obama as VP. I do not want him anywhere near the oval office. I think it would be a good thing if the truth about him came out on some of his connections in Chicago and he had to resign his Senate seat. I do not believe he loves this country or cares about me or the future of my grandchildren or this country as we know it. He desires power and wants it and I believe those who have influence on him (Rev Wright and others we have read about in the many articles) will be right there in the oval office if he gets elected. From what we have seen he will say almost anything to get elected. If he sees that those who were for Hillary are going to vote against him he will make moves to win them over once he has the nomination. He will start saying things you and I want to hear. How many will fall for it? I for one do not want to go there to find out.

I think Hillary can win the nomination. We got to keep working towards that. If she would be beaten than I will vote for McCain as much as I do not want to vote for a Republican. I fear though that voting for McCain will not stop him. Obama must be stopped. If he wins the nomination his rhetoric will quicken and become even more persuasive. The speeches against the Bush Adminstration will become a crescendo and if you think the Media and followers have drunk the kool-aid now...well, it will be like nothing ever seen. Even if a majority who are fighting for Hillary Clinton resist his pitch and decide not to vote for Obama... do not underestimate him. He will be attracting new voters as the media continues to worship him and cast all reports in his glory. Obama has to be stopped now and Hillary Clinton is the only one that can do it. Those in the media who want to defeat him like Hannity are holding their cards to long. If they do not lay them on the table now before Obama gets the nomination I believe it will be too late to stop him. Some of these far out things we have read about him ("A Manchurian candidate, a Trojan horse", etc.) will begin to haunt us as he is sworn in as president.

Hillary...must win the nomination! And if she wins the nomination we must work to get her into the Oval Office. She is the real deal!

Soaring Eagle

04-05-2008, 09:01 PM

I could read Obama as a liar the first time i heard him speak! I also could tell he was all about him and not our country!

Santiago

04-05-2008, 09:13 PM

As a former Latino elected official from a minority district, I have seen many like Obama come and go. I am currently a community activist and have seen BS manifest itself in many forms. Working in the community for so many years, I have learned to separate the wheat from the shaff. In other words, you can't BS a BS'er.

EsmeraldaB

04-06-2008, 06:56 PM

I first started getting turned off when I saw how much the media was bashing Hillary and constantly putting Obama on a pedestal.

Then I started to visit blogs and couldn’t believe the condescending talk out of his supporters. I thought there were be some spirited discussions, but nothing could have prepared me for how downright nasty and hurtful they were to people with opposing views. And some of the names I heard them calling Hillary, well, my blood just started to boil. When watching debates I’d see her get cut off, and Obama had full rein to answer for as long as he wanted. Maybe it just seemed like he had more time, he certainly had less substantial things to talk about, so there was probably dead air space. Hillary was always so full of good info, and always left me wanting to know more. Course I’d never get the chance, because they kept switching over to Obama!

When I watched the Super Tuesday results on in February on CNN, I couldn’t believe how long they waited to declare Hillary the winner of her states! I mean the second the other states ended their voting, up went the “Obama Wins!” projections. They waited a good long time before declaring for Hillary. I finally knew something was up.

Further revelations about the Obama campaign and his “friends” soon had be seeing his guy was a big mistake.

JMS825

04-06-2008, 07:56 PM

I am from Chicago IL I never was turned onto Obama to become turned off. He is as crooked as the rest and he claims to be different.

Cricket22

04-07-2008, 06:25 PM

I agree with all the more elegant comments. But I was nerver "turned on" to Obama in the first place. Here came a kindergartner (in politics) daring to claim to be a better candidate than one of the smartest women this country has ever had. And like the snake in Eden, many fell for him. Are there so few of us with the common sense it takes to recognize incompetence when we see it?

BO does not have the strength of character and the background knowledge that it will take to lead the U.S. in one of its most perilous times.
I agree with the person who fears him as much as Bush. Bush knows what he is doing and does it deliberately. Obama, if elected, will do many of the same things without knowing what he is doing. I believe that he will be easily influenced by anyone he sees as having the "expertise" he is lacking. The President of the United States should at least have a resume suited to the job. BO does not come close. HRC is qualified to the degree that it cannot be questioned. And you notice that no legitimate pundit has ever said that she is not qualified!!

houna

04-07-2008, 07:08 PM

One of the things that disgusted me to the core with him was his immediate reaction when Rev wright comments became public. He said he never knew about it before. As if his first instinct is to run and hide and abandon who ever. Just imagine if he is the president and some crises happened what kind of braveray would you expect from him. Guys please just imaging this cowardese and the media no one point to this huge fact and keep talking about what the Rev said WHO CARES he is not going to be a president. But I guess they want your mind not to go there.

Annie

04-07-2008, 07:19 PM

Yes I agree, Obama is not even near ready to hold the position of the highest job in America. When he is asked about why he thinks he will be ready on day one, he always says the same thing. It is his one and only reply. He says that not only will he be ready but he will be right[/SIZE]. I KNOW YOU MEANT [SIZE="6"]WRIGHT! He bases that on the same old pat and standard answer that he was right about the war and Hillary was not. I would like for one time for a reporter to continue on that and ask him this: Yes we know that is your stance, but what I would like to know is, other than your pat and standard reason, can you tell me what else makes you the right person, with the right qualifications to be the President of the United States from day one? Then people would see just how bad he hums and haws over a question.:)

Interesting your comment and you are quite correct I believe he will be WRIGHT. It is a frightening concept.

I dislike him completely for all of the previous reasons plus his obvious sexism and ageism. He is not a uniter he is a divider and has divided the Democratic party. If BO get the nomination the Democratic party is over.

SadStateOfAffairs

04-07-2008, 07:33 PM

What turned me off about Barack is that he is an inspirational, motivational, highly skilled, good looking, sweet talking, Harvard educated, anti-american, backstabbing, pathalogical lair.

Plus his ties to TUCC, Wright, Farrakhan, Quadaffi, Rezko, Auchi et al wouldn't be my first pick for a "circle of friends". Kinda creepy really.

Bella

04-07-2008, 08:32 PM

I don't like him because he's a fraud, liar, scammer, sneaky little prick that will throw his own grandmother under the bus to pass the buck and dodge responsibility for his own actions (or lack thereof).

I hate his smugness and the way he always sticks his nose in the air like he's looking down upon everyone. The way he looks at Hillary like he is sooooooooooo above her. Like these pics:

http://i30.tinypic.com/33c2lit.jpg

He never shuts the hell up about his Iraq war speech.

He played the race card and sat on his hands smiling while the media and his supporters were calling the Clinton's racists or saying they are making racist remarks.

He refuses to disown Wright. ENOUGH SAID!

His wife is a freaking nutjob. Gawd I cannot stand her. It's so annoying how they pretend to be so lovey-dovey. Well, what's up with this piccy? They look like they are BORED with eachother not to mention Michelle looks like a basketcase.

http://i27.tinypic.com/4iism1.jpg

I'm so sick of people saying how great his speeches are when A. He doesn't even write his speeches and B. He reads off TELEPROMPTERS. All he ever does is show up, read left and right off the teleprompters, stages a few women fainting episodes and people then call him the second coming. He is a FAKE.

Most of his online supporters are absolute scum and racist pieces of garbage. They work in groups to try and get you kicked off or banned from various websites and blogs if you ever say a bad word about their darling. It's nothing more than a cult and hopefully they will all drink the battery acid next.

A couple superficial reasons:

His smokers voice is just gross. I would rather chew glass than listen to that burned up larynx. His finger pointing and hand gestures are just too much. Does he have arthritis in his fingers? Why are they always curled up in the air when he talks? Why does he talk and use his hands to push and sweep? Why does he look at moderators during the debates and pout?

He is just gross.

Justmy.02

04-07-2008, 09:05 PM

My response to Obama was visceral. I've never experienced anything like it before....

Furthermore, I CANNOT for the life of me picture Michelle Obama in the White House, representing the United States in any way, shape or form...

I 'snipped' two of your reasons; they strongly echo my feelings.

Although I've really supported Hillary from the beginning, I will admit the first time I ever heard Obama speak, I liked his attitude and his calm demeanor. Then the more I heard and read, the more strongly a gut feeling gripped me his words were simply words--pleasant sounding, but devoid of true substance. Michelle Obama I mistrusted from the very get-go.

I find BO's 'throwaway' attitude toward his white blood amazing in one who claims to be a 'uniter.' How can one so strongly embrace one half of one's heritage while utterly ignoring the other? I have no problem with him embracing his black heritage, but what happened to the white relatives who raised him? What about that half of his heritage? I find this disturbing because of his stated wish to unite the country. If he dismisses the white half of his background, how can he hope to unify?

And, I will admit, his supporters totally turn me off. They have the hysteric mindset of cult followers and will not listen to or explore anything negative about their candidate, no matter how factual. They appear to me as brainwashed as those who followed other silver-tongued orators, i.e. Hilter, Jim Jones, Warren Jeffs and others. I find their 'pack' attitude puzzling and almost frightening.

When BO is asked a non-scripted or off the cuff question his answers are weak.

He has very little actual experience, only three years as a US Senator, and a sketchy attendance record. Hillary has been a Senator for over twice as long and has been in public service for a long time, not to mention serving as First Lady.

Just some of my reasons...

Mrsawd

04-07-2008, 09:12 PM

Every thing ! To many to know where to start
the list would be lot smaller if you ask what is there to like about this fellow !

So far I have found notta ~!

NewHamster

04-07-2008, 09:32 PM

ALL of this stuff.

But my very first "taste" of the real Obama was after Hillary's win in NH. I live in NH, I had campaigned for her, and though I liked Obama then I thought he'd be better as a candidate in 8 years with more experience under his belt. He had just won in Iowa. Really, race hadn't even been mentioned that I was aware of and I thought it was thrilling that this country had finally risen above that.

The polls the day before the NH primary had Hillary losing. Even my husband was leaning toward Obama because he liked his speeches, though he thought Hillary was better prepared. Then the evening news showed the coffee-shop scene where Hillary got emotional. "THAT is the side of her I've been waiting to see," my husband proclaimed, and he voted for her the next day. He said he really saw how passionate she was, how much she cared.

And she won! It was thrilling. The first time ever a woman had won a Presidential primary!!! This was history!!! So I was astounded to hear on the news Chris Matthews suggest that Hillary only won because the people in NH are closet racists, so closeted in fact, that we would lie to pollsters so no one would THINK we're racist, but behind the curtain of a voting booth (as opposed to a pubic caucus like in Iowa) we wouldn't really vote for a black man!!!!! It didn't seem to occur to him that she won because we VOTED FOR her. To him, there had to be some other reason. This view got some legs in the media and Obama did nothing to stop it. I was HIGHLY offended!!!

Since then I've seen the Obama campaign pull the race card a number of times, and it has turned my stomach. Anyone who listened to Geraldine Ferraro's WHOLE speech would denounce the criticism against her, but he never did; in fact, he compared her to Wright in his race speech!!! To me, using race to get ahead in this campaign is vile. He has intentionally twisted words and intent.

Lastly, I will never forgive him for not doing every thing he can to get the votes in MI and FL to be RIGHT and to COUNT. If he is happy winning this nomination because millions of voters were disenfranchised, I can never respect him, just as I could not respect GW after 2000. He never ackowledged that the real will of the people in FL was not to choose him.If Obama said, "I don't want this unless all the states can vote fairly and we know accurately who the democrats in this country really want as their nominee" I'd have a lot more respect for him. No, he's rationalizing just like GW did. He THINKS he'll be better so it doesn't matter what millions of voters think.

ImmaSlave4U

04-07-2008, 09:41 PM

His performance and attitude in the debates (and the campaign there afrer) turned me off of him completely. But I was always for Hillary...and always will be.

HillaryForPrez

04-08-2008, 04:41 AM

http://i31.tinypic.com/aoxhz6.jpg

cherry2008

04-08-2008, 05:27 PM

I was never turned on by Obama from the beginning, but since I knew very little about him at the time I was going to give him the benefit of the doubt and remain "undecided" although I do like Hillary a lot. I am neither turned on by his looks nor speeches which I pay very little attention too. So no swooning here.

Anyway, what turned me really off about him is his arrogance of saying that he can get Hillary supporters but he is not sure that Hillary can get his supporters!

Even Howard Dean mentioned that the fact that many of Hillary supporters are saying that now, but since we want a Democrat for a president we would obediently support Obama anyway. Some arrogance on his part!

Not me! I will either sit this election out or vote McCain. I don't have a problem doing either. One thing for sure is that Obama won't be getting my vote for any reason. If for some long shot he gets the VP spot, I still won't vote Democrat.

struck_dumb

04-17-2008, 05:33 PM

Hi, Murray!
Democratic Underground got rid of me after a day! I thought it was a democratic party forum, so I assumed that active debate amongst supporters would be of course encouraged and supported :eek: Boy did I get that one wrong. I heard about this site there though when your Today show protest photos were posted.

I got turned off of Barry the first time I saw him, last year on a visit to Washinton DC. I caught the debate where all the male democrats leapt on Hill, dogpile fashion. It was not every man for himself, not at all.

The reason he was so unappealing in that debate was his lack of eloquence or coherence, to be honest. He was sarcastic, and unprepared. He reminded me of Bush, in that he seems to need a script and heavy duty coaching to get through a spontaneous set of Questions. It would have been great if he could have chilled out and got on the ticket with Hill for experience...but if he doesn't win now, his career as Prez will probably never happen now.

PrincesseJen

04-21-2008, 11:54 AM

I basically was turned off when he was getting some popularity and he won Iowa. I've wanted Hillary to run for President for such a long time and now this nobody comes out of nowhere and thinks he can do a better job? This SHOULD be her nomination. :mad:

Jake_Laughton

05-03-2008, 12:45 AM

When choosing a candidate one must look at many things, but the number one thing that has to be observed about any candidate is how will he or SHE be best for the future of my family?

As an author I like Hillary best because her ideology fits closest to my own. This ideology is what is most on my mind and that is MY money!

Anyone of us who is not a millionaire has that very thought.

Based on this fact and having the knowledge first hand from Bill's Presidency, she is the one for me!

I search and search Obama just to be fair, but I find nothing, he speaks well most of the time, But he is the candidate of radical change, this means that he is not the best choice but he is so far and distance in character and color to George Junior.

Young people and new voters DO NOT understand the concept of what is best for their family, most do not have their own family yet!

If they vote Obama in they wil be the ones leading the pack to vote him out in 4 years!

The rich control everything these days we need someone who can restore some government order. Yesterday Hillary said she will restore the oil price caps and my heart soared to hear this! In my book, I explain this key point as one of the reason oil and gas have soared under Bush when they did not under Bill. Replacing the price caps means automatically limiting oil profits which would cause gas price to drop within 1 day's time across our country!

Hence it is clear to me that Obama is not the right man or Woman!

"America's youth have drank the poisoned kool-aid of a presidential candidate who is only good at making speeches"
in reference to Obama, Quoted from J.C. "Jake" Laughton who is
Author of "Death of Democracy:The Erosion of Freedom Doctrine of the Second American Revolution" Available on Amazon!

PA_Voter

05-03-2008, 01:28 AM

I'd be writing for days otherwise....

First: I went to look at their 2006 income disclosures (before any primaries)....

BO listed his religion as "Trinity United Church of Christ"; and, Hillary listed her religion as "Methodist".... I found saying your religion was a church rather intriging....

So I went to TUCC to see what this was about and was turned off after reading about the Black Value System, seeing the Trumpet Magazine touting Farrakhan. Just everything relating to blacks and Africa--not America.... That was a turn-OFF!

Second: In one of the first debates when BO said "You're Likeable Enough Hillary".... That condescending remark and his shallowness clinched the deal for me!

keys_11

05-03-2008, 01:25 PM

I was never turned on by Obama. He had no experience, he had no record of doing anything significant all he did was give sermons not solutions, All he did was attack Hillary’s judgment on a war he just gave a speech on way back in 2000. So now when we are finally seeing him for what he is really about its just icing on the cake.

Juliehillarysupporte

05-03-2008, 02:05 PM

First thing that turned me off was when they played the race card against Hillary and Bill just to get votes in South Carolina. That showed me who they are.

Then of course there has been a million nails in the coffin since then.

You know, what's interesting about Obama being anti gay? He's accused (and I believe it) of having a homosexual encounter with Larry Sinclair and Donald Young (who has been murdered) . There are rumors about him having such relations in High School as well.

Don't they say that those who protest the most, have the most to hide? Maybe he's anti gay to cover up his own feelings. JMO!

leahchamblee

05-03-2008, 02:15 PM

1. he is a racist
2. he pledged Africa over the US when he joined Wrights church
3. he believes that any religion that espouses anything other than a black god should be "taken out"
4. he hangs out with terrorists
5. he is surrounded by fraudulent deals that hurt the people in his district (Rezko)
6. he is disloyal to his own family (grandma)
7. he lies (wright)
8. his wife is a nightmare
9. he has no respect for women (hillary, condeleeza)
10. he has been using lobbyists money to swing superdelegates
11. he used the monies given to him for the campaign to campaign for Odinga his cousin in Kenya who set up sharia law (female slavery, genetalia mutilation, much worse than antebellum slavery), and also began to kill christians (herded christians into churches and mutlilated them then torched the churches)
12. anti-semitic I was not surprised that a doctored tape crept up and made a jew look bad, remember Hitler.
13. His plan is he has no plan

I truly believe that the Odinga thing when the Reps bring it out will topple the democratic party, and good riddance to bad garbage,
It's time we had a party for middle America, One whose platform is not LEFT or RIGHT but moderate 100% and those on the fringe are not allowed to remain.

Grandma / Odinga / NOI and black theology / Rezko / those are my main reasons.

Ray_of_Hope

05-12-2008, 04:04 PM

Thank you so much, Murray, for sharing your list with us. I can definitely tell that you put a lot of thought into your reasons. They're logical, objective, and compelling. I don't think I can top this, because you expressed everything that I have been feeling about "America's ordained Messiah".

I especially want to thank you for pointing out that it was the Obama camp that pulled the race card. Too many people believe otherwise and will froth at the mouth if you dare try to enlighten them on the truth. I won't claim that the Clintons are perfect (perfect people don't exist), but to paint them as racist is beyond despicable. Anyone who doesn't see that Obama is using the African American community (and the young, to an extent) is in denial, as far as I'm concerned. A telling moment for me was seeing Hillary Clinton and John McCain (yes, JOHN MCCAIN) in attendance at the MLK memorial, but not "Mr. Hope and Change". And why? A scheduling conflict. Whatever.

I would like to add my two cents:

1. Obama's constant disrespect for Hillary has left a sour taste in my mouth.
Examples include making comments like "You're likeable enough, Hillary", giving Hillary the finger during his many trite speeches (scratching your face with your middle finger, indeed. You are not slick!), and minimizing her (and Bill's) accomplishments.

2. The public is starting to see a childish, crass side to the great messiah. The brushing of the shoulders? The temper tantrums he throws when he loses? The mocking laughter when addressing Hillary's criticisms of his policies? Sorry, I look for grace and maturity in a candidate.

3. He is a human chameleon. One minute, he is the biracial son of hope. The next minute, he was a poor black boy whose mother had to use food stamps to survive. A minute after that, he was born to parents who met that fateful day in Selma, AL. Ten minutes, after that, his grandmother (the one who raised his ungrateful behind and provided him with some semblance of a normal life) is a closet racist. What next, he started his early childhood as a freedom fighter?

4. If he talks about his role as a community organizer one more time.......and how is it that no one has yet come out and confirm his accomplishments?

5. His whole campaign is based on a lie! He claims that he is the great uniter and will help heal the nation of party and racial divides. Sadly, I placed my faith in him partly because of his platform. I was (and am) tired of this whole obsession with race and opposing parties (although, I must wonder just how much of these divisions are exaggerated by the media, but that's another topic for another day). I wanted a different mindset to penetrate the American society. Well, he's united the country, all right. One big happy country.

6. I just love how people try to dismiss his ties to certain individuals. Would Hillary have been given the same pass?

7. Forgive me, but I cannot STAND his wife. I tried really hard to give her a chance, but the woman makes my skin crawl. She is a brilliant woman, but she clearly has a lot of issues. I understand the effects of discrimination. I truly do. However, I also acknowledge when progress has been made. As successful as she is, she cannot find ONE positive thing to say? ONE? Seriously?

I also resent her subtle bullying of people (especially young people and people of color) into supporting Obama. It is because I have awakened that I am NOT supporting Obama.

joeylee

05-12-2008, 04:20 PM

Hi Y'all, Here is a letter I wrote and sent to several Editorial Authors after receiving one of the "Alerts" from the "rapid Responders", I think it's of my better writings and would love some critique, also, if anyone wants to use it to send to others, you have my full permission to do so:

Written by Joseph Lee (I never use Joseph, unless I am REAL serious):

Dearest Mr. Gailey & Others,
Well. I guess you have made up the mind for all Americans that have yet to cast a vote, and to hell with them? That's the way pundits like you made me feel prior to the elections in Pennsylvania, however, it did not change the minds of many, did it? It certainly did not change mine. See, I am disabled, on Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid, so my entire life is pretty much up to the next President. Do I entrust it with a Man that has ties to known terrorists; Ayers, El-Hady to name just two, a pastor that has had his words "taken out of context", or so we've been expected to just dismiss; OR, do we entrust our future into someone with Experience, one who's "baggage" has been hashed and rehashed more than most liberal politicians?

See, I feel Senator Clinton is a Champion for everything that is important to those like myself, as well as those more concerned with having a President with Experience while our Nation is at war. Then again, a three year Junior Senator who has spent two of the three years campaigning for the very spot people like You have already given him, he should receive the vote because...? He speaks well? He has a past that he "prefers to not dwell on", little or no experience whatsoever, has proven that when "pushed", he squanders. Wow again! What a difficult choice, maybe you were right! I highly doubt it based on what I have just laid out.

It still amazes me, in 42 years, never have I seen a less "dirty" campaign that this one, never. And, all of these issues that have conveniently been left out of the press and the MSM will no doubt be brought up again, during the National Election unlike anything we have ever seen. Rush Limbaugh has won! Imagine that!? He wanted "Operation Chaos" and he has achieved it, with all thanks to those of the ilk like yourself.

My Sincere Condolences,
Joseph Lee
Scranton, PA.
_________
Joey Lee*

eyedoc333

05-12-2008, 07:55 PM

Hey, all. yes, i'm one of what you call the "obamabots" (but not the weirdo cultish rude kind i've been hearing about!) but would you please post this and talk with me anyway? i've been trying to talk with you all on Senator Clinton's blog, but even if i just ask questions (nice ones! about policy!) they never get posted. i even sent in a happy Mother's Day (since I liked the video with Chelsea) and even that one didn't get on. and i'm not here to "spy" or to criticize or tell you to leave the race. I think Senator Clinton SHOULD stay in the race! She IS experienced, and talented, and has all the other qualities you all admire. I pride myself on being a 'tough chick' and she's a freakin' inspiration. I checked out this site to try and understand your positions that's all. Since this thread is about what turned you off Obama, is there any sense of a certain event, or time that you all got turned off? Or is it that your dedication to your candidate just grew and grew? Either way, the passion you guys are showing is awesome. No joke. I don't take offense to the hostility, since you've probably heard from some real "winners" from our side--for what it's worth from me, sorry.

I'm all for inclusiveness, as long as we stay positive about Hillary. I am one of the few here who doesn't think badly of Obama. I simply think that Hillary has more qualifications and experience. I enjoy it here because it's the one place I can go that doesn't dismiss Hillary and her campaign these days.

jdona

05-12-2008, 08:39 PM

I'll be honest about why I dislike Obama. He has no qualifications to be President. He hasn't even run a state. He has been a US Senator for 4 years, and two of those years he has been running for President. He has a snarky, rude, sexist attitude. He has constantly and consistently denigrated Bill Clinton's Presidency, and Hillary Clinton's contributions to this country. He copies her policies, because he doesn't have any of his own. He has a history of destroying his competition that goes all the way back to the Illinois State Senate, and for all his talk of hope and change, he is a dirty politician. Check out his underhanded destruction of his competitor in the Illionois State Senate election. But to be brutally honest, its his supporters that have turned me off the most. Their attitudes, their insults, their constant insinuations that those of us who support Hillary are uneducated, illiterate, and unsophisticated, outrage me. Obama's mouthpieces, especially Axlerod and Donna Brazille's statements about Hillary Dem's being "old dinosaurs" that no longer represent the Democratic Party are insulting. The man is another Jimmy Carter, only Carter was in fact more qualified than Obama. At least Carter was a one term governor and knew how to manage a state's budget. Take that with Wright, Ayers, Rezko, and all the other questionable friends, bittergate, typical white person and all his other juvenile remarks, his foreign policy flubs, and you see a man not quite ready for primetime, certainly not ready to lead the world's only superpower. There is nothing about Barack Obama I can honestly say I like, certainly nothing I trust, and nothing I respect. And this household has 5 soon to be former Democrats who will be voting for John McCain for no other reason that to cast a protest vote over the Democratic Party's shoddy treatment of Hillary and Bill Clinton. We have survived 8 years of Bush, we can survive 4 more of McCain. And hopefully in 2012, we can field a Democratic nominee that doesn't divide this country into the have and have nots, the men versus women, blacks versus white and the rich against the poor. I certainly hope so.

eyedoc333

05-12-2008, 08:57 PM

That's very cool of you. I respect your decision totally, and I know what you mean. I don't even like visiting any MSM blogs, since there ARE some very angry "obamabots" out there. Sometimes people post negative stuff over on the HQ blog, but I always tell them to chill, since "do unto others" you know? They just don't understand, can't look at the bigger picture, and are as frustrated as everyone else, I think.
By the way, I have been calling West Virginia today (just doin' my job!) and you all should rack up a HUGE win tomorrow. Early congrats. I had more voters for Hillary than for Obama, and everyone was SO nice. Everyone was just excited to be voting, and I had a few of your fellow Clinton supporters even thank me for working! Would you do me a favor though, and let your friends know that not all of us are lame?

Bonnie, it's people like you who give me hope. Let's all remember that we are all human beings with hopes, dreams, and aspirations. We may have passionate differences about our candidate of choice, but we can embrace both our similarities and differences. I wish you all the best, no matter the outcome in WV or elsewhere. Peace.

joeylee

05-12-2008, 10:02 PM

I agree with the others that have posted, I think it's rather big of you to "want" to be here. As for my response to your question, lack of experience is the key reason. I am 42, I lived through the First Clinton years and as I remember them, we were a lot better off then, than we are now. The mess that G.W. Bush has left is a large one. I just honestly believe though that it will take someone with experience, someone that "has been there", to clean us out of the mess Bush has put us in.

If we were not a country at war, my feelings might not be so decisive. But, being on Social Security, on Medicare & Medicaid, my entire future lies with the next President. In these areas, Senator Clinton is a Champion, one of a kind, been there done that, she's had her baggage hashed and rehashed, so we know there are no "skeletons" to come out. I wish I could say the same for your "choice", but I have done way too much research, and believe me, it IS my future, along with SO many other's, on the line, in every way you can possibly imagine.

This is why here, you should see, if only one thing stands out, the "passion" we have. No ill remarks, although I am sure some are posted out of frustration. Honestly, you are the first person I have yet to meet that hasn't been crude off of the immediate "hello". It's some thing I just cannot grasp nor understand with so much on the line.

I think the one thing we can all agree on is the MESS that Bush has left us, is leaving us, and will continue to build on as he tries to improve his 20' something approval rating.

I wish You the best, I hope I have answered your questions.

Best & Kindest Regards,
Joey Lee* :)

ScottVA

05-14-2008, 10:45 PM

In this Presidential Primary race so much has surfaced about Obama. It turns out that he's a MAJOR NATIONAL SECURITY THREAT with all his connections to shady underground types, terrorist groups and injust Chicago style politics! I WILL NEVER EVER vote for him and have already planned to vote McCain if Hillary isn't the nominee. I will not even vote for the ticket if he decides to get Hillary to run as VP. As long as he's the one in the WH I won't support it! The red lights and sirens should be going off like mad right now for this citizens of this great Country!

joeylee

05-15-2008, 08:57 AM

Totally agree Scott*. In my case though, I may just sit home.
haven't decided which yet.

nette60

05-15-2008, 09:15 PM

It amazes me that Dean, kerry and pelosi expects John Mccain to apologize to their 'precious' aftre the comments Bush made today (which were absolutely true) But they won't ask Obama and the media to apologize to Hillary...what hypocrites..I will never forgive Obama for the way he has treated Hillary and Bill Clinton

jerseygirl7

05-15-2008, 09:33 PM

what turn me of is his string of lies.

He lacks integrity, truthfulness, honesty. A man in power need to have a firm grip on these important principles. Otherwise he will easily abuse the power.

Obama is not qualified to have that power.

And for this very reason, I believe McCain will be a better president if it comes down between these two.

I am proud to say I was never turned ON to him - FROM DAY ONE! Wolf in sheep's clothing! I must say I have never listened to him speak - immediate mute or channel change. I have read many things about him but again proud to say I disagree with everything! The only reason he is where is today is because of the caucus states which he took advantage of and the illegal voting activity with absentee ballots. Still boggles the mind that NOTHING was done by HRC's campaign to expose it.

Hillary bumper sticker will be accompanied by McCain if Nobama gets the nod. I am not one for making statements via bumper stickers but this time I want everyone to know if its not Hillary than this Dem is voting McCain.

But hoping for her to pull this off so I won't have to do it!!!!!!

keys_11

05-15-2008, 10:13 PM

Why not Nader or a Clinton write- in you ask? Easy that won’t stop Obama a vote for Mc Cain will and I for one prefer McCain over Obama any day. I’m an American first then Democrat.

Michael White

05-20-2008, 06:38 PM

I'M not going to lie and say otherwise, it was his very name. I'M sorry I'M so narrow minded but the name Barack HUSSEIN Obama is not one that will make me sleep well at night.

Then I heard him speak. I have never in my life heard such nonsense, 30 minutes of catch phrases that didn't say a thing. Empty words.

When the Reverand Wright scandal broke and McCain was on FOX News defending him and BO never said a thing till about a month later?

The idea of Wright,Jackson and Farakan ordering up late night snacks from the phone in The Linclon Bedroom... .

Yeppers I could go on but you just asked what was THE FIRST.

Eridon

05-23-2008, 11:57 PM

I suspected he was a phony the first time I saw him on TV. I was already familiar with Hillary's platform, and was searching for where they were similar or different -- and what I heard was an appalling lack of substance. Shortly afterwards, I heard about the plagarism, and it made sense. His lack of substance has amazed me ever since.

That's also when I realized that the Democratic Party had a secret agenda. At first I thought it was only MSNBC, because Hillary voted against Bush's energy bill, and GE lost lots of money and GE and Microsoft own MSNBC -- but that wouldn't explain the obvious pro-Obama, anti-Hillary behavior on the part of the Supers. This made me turn off Obama even more, because his confidence was so embarrassingly misplaced, except that he was obviously told he had it made.

All his talk about "working with the Republicans" and "holding hands across the aisle" fell apart when I learned what happened to his bill, and how the Republicans watered it down so much, it was non-existent. So much for holding hands with the devil. I wonder what they would do with OBAMA'S idea of a health plan.

Meanwhile, I was hearing about the Canadian Ambassador, then Farrakhan, Rezko, Wright, and Michelle Obama -- and it made me wonder if the white right wing was still behind the Black Muslim Church like they were when Elijah Mohammed was running it, which is what got both Malcom X and Ahmad Jamal assassinated, when Elijah found out that they found out. It made me wonder if these same beauts were funding the endless millions for his campaign. The simple fact that I was even thinking this of him was because he was so suspicious.

I was also turned off because he was not at all on the same page with regard to Hillary's health care plan. He apparently didn't see the film "Sicko" and was clueless about what every other modern country already has in place, making us freedom loving Americans look like oppressed fools. Then, I realized he did not do his homework about a lot of things, like his "slip" about the USA having 57 states, and apparently winging it with wishy washy policy flip flop ideas. He himself couldn't remember what he said the last time. Then it seemed like he didn't care any more, because he had this crazy confidence he was "the winner" and it was a done deal. This alone made me very distrustful, like maybe he was involved with criminal activities, and maybe the insurance companies and God knows who else were paying for his campaign.

It really made me angry to see him ignoring the fact that Hillary was winning, and he was blithely going on to "debate" (Obama-style) with McCain, while being oh so kind and charitable to her in the media.

I find his lack of substance, his ignorance, and his youthful inexperience to be frightening for a President of the United States. Perhaps he got the idea from observing Bush that the Presidency is a joke.

Obama has no plan to deal with the national debt. Maybe it's a joke to him, but I find it especially scary in these times when so much is horrendous. Not only are so many people going bankrupt, but the nation itself is going bankrupt. What happens when it's over? It's almost over, right now! I've heard people say, "He can always find the right advisors," to which I answer, "So where are they?"

When I was at the caucus in my town, I openly spoke to the large group of people who were waiting on line to get in. I heard people in front of me talk about supporting Obama, and I asked why -- to which one of them answered, "I just can't see a woman President, and I won't vote for McCain."
I couldn't believe what he said, and not a single Obama supporter contradicted him. The one who said it was a middle aged man with white hair. The woman standing next to me was also a middle aged white-haired Obama supporter. I asked her why -- she said "I like his message." What message? "Change, hope." I said, "And Hillary doesn't speak of change and hope?" To which she said, "I don't like Hillary, she's too stiff." I said, "What do you want from her? You want her to chew gum?" Thinking ONLY of their appearances, she changed her vote!!!! I swear, under oath, this really happened!!! No wonder Hillary is winning.
There's no way that their candidate can compete with reality.

It's no longer Obama who turns me off, because he's just being used, but the secret agenda that the party bosses keep clinging to. Whatever it is, they're either scaring the Supers to death, or buying them off.

Tonight there was a conference call from Bill Clinton to the governor of Maine's brother, which Hillary's delegates were invited to listen to. Hearing Bill Clinton's familiar voice on the phone was so real, and then to listen to the incredible knowledge he has, and the brilliance of his mind -- made me realize how special he and Hillary both are, as people -- and that this country would have to be nuts not to tell the difference. He also had an awesome command of the math involved, which puts Hillary way ahead, if you include Florida and Michigan, which they will surely do, or else.

it's no wonder Hillary is so far ahead in both popular and electoral votes, because she knows so much and has been actively working on and in ALL OF IT. Her list of the issues is merely a hint of what's been going on, witness Ed King's blog entry about family farms as a reminder. Who on earth would choose Obama when we can have so much better? Why gamble, when we KNOW who Hillary is and what she has done. That's why she does so well when she campaigns in person -- I saw her in Boston, and I already liked her, but in Boston, she blew me away.

Eridon

05-24-2008, 12:22 AM

McCain might have been the secret agenda. "Get rid of Hillary, and there's only McCain." More big oil, insurance companies rule, kiss the coastline good bye, let the banks ravish the land, and 100 more years of Pentagon Capitalism.

Robin Orlowski

05-24-2008, 02:08 PM

The very first thing was the anti-gay tour. I was offended that somebody attempting to run as a progressive who had worked in civil rights was seriously engaging in such a practice.

Then he was insisting (and still is) that he is a good candidate because of his vote against Iraq. That was made when he was a State Legislator---and the U.S. Senate Foregin Relations Committee was recieving information which they sincerely believed to be gennuine. National Security hearings are not held 'for the fun of it'.

No comprehensive healthcare reform plan. He is insisting that we only need to make it more affordable. This selectively forgets myself and other tax-paying citizens with disabilities who regularly get denied coverage only because of the 'pre-existing' medical conditions.

Trying to ignore the sigifigance of HRC having performed door-to-door canvasing for passage of federal special education. This IS a civil rights law, and in addition to not liking GLBT people, Obama does not appear to like myself and other people with disabilities.

the 'present votes'.

Only wanting votes to 'count' if they will support him. HRC knows that every voter will not support her and/or everything she does. But people are not voting in order to vote the way she wants, they are voting to express their preferences for what they want in America. Again, something a civil rights advocate WOULD know.

His HORRIBLE debate skills and lack of benefit from "Ivy League Education". At the very least, a president should know that America has 50 states!

keys_11

05-24-2008, 05:57 PM

Eridon

05-25-2008, 01:04 PM

Back in 1986 I was injured at my job. I was the director of a crisis intervention unit with a private office at City Hall in Maine's largest city. I was a member of the social workers' union. We had good insurance policies. But because my injury was work related, my insurance policy became non-existent. I had to go through the Workers' Comp. division instead and could not use my policy. THEY WERE BOTH AT THE SAME COMPANY!! But I had to go through hell, and it took years to "prove" I was injured. Then, later on, I had to go through the whole thing, all over again. That time, I had to prove it was the same injury. In other words, the only purpose of Workers Comp was to enable the insurance company to stall and try not to pay anything. Regardless, I am permanently injured because of the stalling, and then I couldn't get the help I needed no matter what. Now I'm federally certified disabled because of this. Now I have Medicare, and Medicare doesn't cover everything it should. There are many, many things Medicare doesn't cover, and there are people who are much worse off than I am and dying because of this.

If we had the same kind of insurance as they do in Europe, Canada, and Cuba, this would never be going on. Hillary gets it. Obama is either clueless or corrupt. Either way, the choice for a President is clear.

Homeowners Insurance is becoming the same as health insurance. It's a fraud. You and all the rest pay premiums, and then something happens to the house, and they won't pay for the proper repairs, or they won't pay at all. I have taken them to court, and the judge sides with the insurance company! How is this possible? Corruption.

Another thing the elite got away with in Maine is that there is no such thing as an appeals court any more. Used to be that we could appeal a judge's decision, whether a court judge or a hearing judge -- and now, no more. The insurance companies know this, and the judges and hearing officers know this, and take total advantage. What they did was to change the process of an appeal, making it so complicated and so time consuming, as well as impossible to win, that lawyers in Maine have stopped taking appeals because they cannot afford them and they're futile anyway.

The insurance companies really got away with stacking the deck while the Republicans were in charge and now there is really a mess to untangle. But with universal single payer health insurance, all the stacking won't work any more.

What baffles me more than Obama, who we already know is not going to be helpful -- is the betrayal of the supers. Especially Edwards and Kennedy, who have a situation in their personal lives and a feeling for the poor and they know damn well what's going on.

I think we need to find out a lot more about the supers so we can put the pressure on THEM, which is critical.

joeylee

05-25-2008, 01:23 PM

I read your post twice, just to make sure I had read it correctly. I am so sorry for all you have had to go through. Unfortunately, while reading it I felt like I had written it! You would be amazed at the similarity of or situations, both Comp related, both Hell, both painted me out to be either "faking" or "drug addicted", it was, and in so many ways, still is a nightmare. I am also now physically disabled, permanently. The process is so broken that it will take no one other than Senator Clinton to DO something about it. These very same issues are what made me get involved in this campaign as much as I have. I know She is a Champion for ME, for Health Care, for Medicare, and for Medicaid along with Social Security.

My battles were in the Nineties, thankfully President Clinton was in office, however, the Republican Congress blocked most everything he tried to accomplish.

With this election, I know in my heart, having Senator Clinton as President along with a Democratic Congress, I have a chance at, and the Right to, the quality of Health Care that I, and so many other Americans, deserve.

These are perfect examples for the DNC as to why we NEED to have Our Champion as the Nominee. Much like what you said, "Obama hasn't a clue".

I do Hope & Pray the Very Best for You*!
JoeyLee*
My story is at; http://www.joeylee.com/lifewithrsd.html

Joebasic

06-02-2008, 05:24 PM

The Clintons have spent YEARS helping out the black community and suddenly, because a black guy comes along, the Clintons are called racists and told to **** off?
I will N.E.V.E.R vote for Obama...E.V.E.R.
He also seems to have inspired the most hateful, ignorant supporters around. Loud, shrill, hateful, with nothing to say but Chaaaaange.

Donald

06-02-2008, 05:33 PM

What turned me off of Obama...hmmm. I actually liked him in the beginning.

However, the antics of his campaign in South Carolina and turning the election into a race issue quickly turned me against him.

Then the more I listened, the less I learned. His policies may be similar to Clinton's( more like rip-offs), he did not express the issues the way Hillary has.

Now, All the church stuff..

joeylee

06-02-2008, 05:50 PM

to answer this question; This has been bothering me ever since the MSM began their Hijacking of the election. "What turned me off Obama?", well, actually, to have been turned off sort of assumes that at some point I was not turned off. But, I will gladly share my reasoning;

This Country we live in is at War! Not one, but at least TWO major wars right now, both of which we are loosing our Greatest Men and Women each and every day to. I just had to get gas in my Jeep Cherokee Laredo this morning, I got $20 which gave me just barely a quarter of a tank.

So, to answer the question; Who IS Barack H. Obama? That is the question I need answered! I have been researching day after day, learning one horrible thing after another, with maybe a sliver of something unselfish for a brief time in his entire past. He has spent two of his three years in the Senate running for President, that gives him a whopping ONE year of Government Service to his credit, ONE YEAR!

I, along with David*, as well as his entire Family, absolutely REFUSE to cast a single ballot for "the presumptive nominee" under ANY circumstance!

I apologize for such a long-winded answer, but like I said, I have waited and waited to answer this question, as I hoped with every fiber of my being that I would be able to answer this question with at least something positive to say; and I'm afraid I have nothing positive to say about this arrogant, cocky, so sure of himself, elitist snob; Barack Hussein Obama.

Peace to All Here!
JoeyLee* :mad: Mad as Hell!

Florida Dawn

06-02-2008, 06:13 PM

In the summer of 2007, I carefully considered all the Dems running. I had voted for Kusenich (sp) in the 04 primary, and Kerry in the GE. After researching all of them on the internet, I chose John Edwards. I felt very strongly at the time that he would most likely be the one who could effectively take up the mantle of my beloved hero, Bobby Kennedy. He seemed to really care about the horrible suffering of the poor in this country, those still hurting from Hurricane Katrina and about getting medical assistance for all of us. He seemed to be experience and heart in one great candidate.

Brother, was I wrong!

My husband was for Hillary from the summer of '07 onward. He said "she has more b*lls than all of the Dem candidates put together." (Don't shoot me, I am only the messenger on this, lol)

When it became apparent in late January that Senator Edwards wasn't going to make it, I re-considered my options. Yes, I did consider Senator Obama. I chose not to vo for him because:

1. Too inexperienced.
2. Too inexperienced
3. Too inexperienced

In addition to those reasons, there is this:

He's wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy tooooooooooooooo inexperienced

And did I mention: He has no experience?

Race never entered the pic for me. That's why it hurts so much when angry people in the MSM like Roland Martin (and he is one furious man! It'sa wonder he hasn't had a heart attack yet!) et al scream in fury that anyone who supports any candidate other than Senator Obama is a racist. Of course, the Obama supporters are not racists, lol! Or sexists, for that matter.

Talk about a disgusting sense of entitlement on the part of Obama supporters!

But I digress.

There is something unreal about Obama's policies. I cannot see them being applied in actuality. It was nothing personal; his stands on the issues have no resonance with me.

I intuitively feel that there is nothing to him but empty rhetoric. He opens his mouth and someone else's words (Teddy's? Kerry's? Dean's?) come out. I feel he has been rail-roaded into being a mouthpiece for something or someone that has yet to really reveal itself.

After reading both candidates' websites, going to the blogs and reading about both candidates written by their supporters, I chose to go for Hillary. I voted for her in the Florida primary; as I left my precient I wept for my small contribution to history. I did not know how invisible I have felt as a woman in this country, especially one who has seemingly been "put out to pasture" by the very party I have supported since the 1970s.

I made the BEST choice, and I have never looked back.

seawave

06-05-2008, 04:09 PM

For me, it's the deception, dishonesty and divisiveness. These evoke a very negative response from me.

I agree. Those serving in our military deserve better. Americans deserve better even the confused ones.

Robin Orlowski

06-05-2008, 05:17 PM

I admit, way back when, I had read his book--and liked parts of it. But I actually knew little about him.

Then during the campaign, all the stuff I had earlier mentioned re: his issue positions came out.

In addition to those which were not very progressive, his general air reminded me of a 'community organizer' whom I myself had accidentally worked with--and who had also dumped me and our work when things were no longer 'easy'.

Seeing him debate with others also gave me indication of how he is going to perform against McCain. McCain is going to cream him and the ticket--exempting Rezko or somebody else talking!

And the savvy politician does not get unhinged when late night comedy sketches satirize them!

CT-Hilltopper

06-06-2008, 03:14 PM

(1). His association with Louis Farakhian, the Rev. Wright, Ayers, and people who hate this country. The Trinity Church was receiving millions in tax dollars for outreach programs, etc. Did he have anything to do with that?

(2). The fact that he could attend Trinity for over 20 years and NOT KNOW its a hate church, and that the Rev. Wright is a minister of hate. What did he do for 20 years, attending that church, sleep? Play video games? Talk on his cell phone? What?!?

(3). His association with Tony Rezko. Not association. His dealings.

(4). The fact that he can have business dealings with Tony Rezko, then turn around and say that "this was not the Tony Rezko" he knew.

(5). The fact that he states that he promotes change but all he promotes is arrogance. P.T. Barnum stated, "There's a sucker born every minute.", and I think of that when I see how staged everything is around him. The perpetual "halo" effect in the lighting that creates a halo around him every time he speaks, the staged seating of whites in visible places around the podium to increase his appeal to the white voters. Anything that has to be sold this hard isn't very substantive. His followers need to get beyond the glitz and listen to him hard. Beyond the glitz, there's nothing there.

(6). The way the DNC is selling he and his wife as the second coming of Camelot. John F Kennedy had his flaws personally, as we've come to find out, but that doesn't take away from the fact that he was one damn great President. And Jacqueline Kennedy wrote the book as far as being First Lady.
To borrow a phrase from Lloyd Bentson, "Obama is no Jack Kennedy". Not even close. Michelle Obama is nowhere near being a Jacqueline Kennedy. So you Obamabots can take that line of reasoning and stuff it.

(7). Michelle Obama. Everything about her. The ARROGANCE. When she told Hillary that she couldn't run her own house, what made her think she could run the White House. Her turn's coming. If the mainstream media were doing their job right now, her turn would be here. John McCain wants to run a clean campaign, but one of those splinter groups will blow his backside out of the water if he has anything to hide. The only sad thing is they'll wait until the general election.

(8). His followers are toxic, and he does nothing to reign them in.

(9). You can't turn on a news channel anywhere and not see Barack Obama. Or someone who is speaking for Barack Obama. MSNBC = More Stupid News about Barack Continuously. It's all Barack all the time. What happened to journalistic integrity and objectivity?

(10) He stole my birthday. It's toxic now. I'll have to celebrate on another day. I don't want to share a birthday with him.

I could go on. One of the biggies that aren't here is that since he doesn't have a real message, if you disagree with him, he will find a way to paint you as a racist.

And he and his inner circle welcoming Hillary, and going through the motions of welcoming Bill, but talking behind his back about how "toxic" he is to their campaign.

If I were Hillary, I would tell Obama to shove it. I would tell the DNC to shove it.

Two good reasons I'm not in politics.

GOHillary08

06-06-2008, 03:24 PM

When I first learned that BO was in the running, I googled and found out a little about him. I then discovered that he was an author, and went onto Amazon where you can get a look at different pages to see whether you want to purchase a book. That's all it took for me.

suerw

06-06-2008, 07:49 PM

Florida Dawn wrote:
There is something unreal about Obama's policies. I cannot see them being applied in actuality. It was nothing personal; his stands on the issues have no resonance with me.

I intuitively feel that there is nothing to him but empty rhetoric. He opens his mouth and someone else's words (Teddy's? Kerry's? Dean's?) come out. I feel he has been rail-roaded into being a mouthpiece for something or someone that has yet to really reveal itself.

This was my first impression, too, and remains my impression. Watching and listening to him early on in this campaign, I heard nothing but empty rhetoric and saw a disdain for the people he was addressing. Research into the candidates' experience and positions confirmed this impression to be accurate. So, even Obama's tainted associations were made public knowledge, I had made up my mind that he was not a candidate I would support.

suerw

06-06-2008, 07:51 PM

I could read Obama as a liar the first time i heard him speak! I also could tell he was all about him and not our country!

Yes, that was very obvious, wasn't it?

ddprice

06-08-2008, 12:24 PM

If Obama's numers go down low enough in the national polls, and if Hillary does not accept the VP slot, it seems to me that the Democratic Party would have no option at the convention, other than selecting Hillary as the nominee, if they want to win in the general election.

I just think it is dangerous for us, as a nation, to condone the media's blantant selection of the Democratic nominee. They have essentially rendered our voting process invalid, with their propaganda. It looks like they are about to choose the president for us, as well, in the general election, as they all appear to be selecting Obama as president.

I not only refuse to vote for Obama because he is the media's choice, but I strongly believe him to be a hypocrite and untrustworthy.

Michael White

06-08-2008, 12:59 PM

Besides his inexperience and his ties to an extremist church, it comes down to my own ability to judge an individual's character. In every area he is wanting.

Party unity? Not me, I wanna be able to sleep at night knowing if a disaster, man made or natural occured there would be someone capable of helping and protecting all of us.

President Of The United States, Commander In Chief these are the titles we are talking about giving a 46 year old junior senator from Illinois? Not on my watch.

My first allegiance is to our country and who I feel is best to suited to represent us and look out for our best interests. I'M an American first and a Democrat second.

My vote is going to McCain. I will encourage others to do so as well. Sadly I can not afford to contribute financially because I just don't seem to have any extra money these days. Somewhere between the gas pumps and the grocery store it gets ate up. I dug deep and gave what I could to HRC and would do so again, but I'M tapped out and disgusted.

Sadly I must respectfully decline the wishes of my beloved HRC and put America ahead of The Democratic Party.

dontrustobama

06-08-2008, 01:23 PM

I only have one (besides my instincts) reason that i can prove is a GOOD reason not to trust Obama and that is that he is a THIEF. Anyone who has watched this race unfold week after week SAW IT ON TV!!! I was always taught that it was wrong to accept something from someone when it was not theirs to give. In otherwords if you give me something but it belongs to someone else and i accept it i am a thief. The DNC gave Obama 4 Delegates that were clearly earned by Hillary. Obama accepted them with narry a word about the fact that it was wrong to accept them. Obama in turn STOLE Delegates that were not his and did it on television for all to see. That in short proves that he is a thief. There is no way around it. I WILL NEVER ACCEPT A CLEARLY PROVEABLE THIEF IN THE WHITE HOUSE REPRESENTIING THIS COUNTRY!!!!!

Robin Orlowski

06-08-2008, 01:56 PM

The stolen delegates are VERY troubling. After all of the fuss made about Florida in 2000, the DNC later insisted that it had a right to 'correct' the election results in 2008. It did not want the people's ballots to be properly counted in this election.

And what is more ironic is that the DNC is currently chaired by the 'progresive' Howard Dean. I am so grateful that in the 2000 primaries when I had still been with the DNC, I had stuck by Gore and was not impressed with Dean.

The general public will have no incentive to participate in an electoral process where the outcome can be corrected to suit the whims of a party and or candidate.

suerw

06-08-2008, 03:46 PM

Michael White wrote:
My first allegiance is to our country and who I feel is best to suited to represent us and look out for our best interests. I'M an American first and a Democrat second.

I'm so glad there are so many here who think this way.

ddprice

06-09-2008, 11:23 AM

I would go through the gates of hell to vote for Hillary for president, but I cannot vote for Obama, with or without Hillary as vice president, because I cannot condone the manner in which Obama was selected as nominee. It was an extremely biased and sexist media, a biased and corrupt DNC, and an undemocratic process that made Obama the nominee.

I saw a post on another web site that called Obama a post turtle and defined it this way: a post turtle is a turtle sitting on top of a fence post. He didn't get up there by himself, he doesn't belong up there, he doesn't know what to do while he is up there, and a moron put him up there.

suerw

06-09-2008, 11:50 PM

I saw a post on another web site that called Obama a post turtle and defined it this way: a post turtle is a turtle sitting on top of a fence post. He didn't get up there by himself, he doesn't belong up there, he doesn't know what to do while he is up there, and a moron put him up there.

Perfect description!!

dontrustobama

06-09-2008, 11:57 PM

Personally i never liked him from the start. I just didn't believe him. I have learned to trust my instincts and they said NO! But since then the only thing that i can absolutely positively PROVE beyond any reasonable doubt is this. When i was a kid i learned not to take anything from anyone if i knew it wasnt theirs to give. If i took it i was a thief. Well beyond a shadow of a doubt Obama is a thief cause he was given 4 of Hillary's delegates from Michigan that he didnt earn. I can understand the "other " vote to try to be fair but not what Hillary won. They were hers and he accepted them without a thank you or a blink. He's all about winning fair or not and he's a thief

dontrustobama

06-09-2008, 11:59 PM

Robin Orlowski

06-10-2008, 10:03 AM

I've accidentally worked with people like him before. The 'community organizer' tag is a facade to lure people in, right down to the 'hope' lines.

I was lucky that I hadn't contributed any money--and merely my time. But I left those experiences feeling so 'used' and exploited. I am worried what what will happen to America as a whole. :eek::eek:

sociallybanned

06-10-2008, 01:39 PM

Where do I begin ! First , I supported Barack Obama in the beginning of 2007. Every news magazine from The Nation to The American Prospect worshipped his ground. To say the least, I jumped on that rock star bandwagon but that's not my personality. I doubt praise , especially when you hear, read over and over the same stuff. I know the media, they report negatives and positives of a candidate. But this guy, they depict him as some angel, some MLK candidate. Then, I started to research voting records on all candidates. I like Biden's ability to stand up to the President when no one else did, then I liked Hillary's policies and voting record. She;s been consistently speaking about her stance for decades. One thing that threw me off was the NAFTA. Then I'd searched that even Unions backed NAFTA and results had shown that the US was benefiting from NAFTA, at one time. I also discovered that NAFTA wasn't created by the Clintons. It goes back to Nixon. When NAFTA was signed into action, Bush SR, Gerald Ford, Carter and Bill Clinton were all together for a photoshoot. This wasn't a one man , one president deal. It had backing from the same ppl that opposes NAFTA today. And therefore the media pinned it on one candidate. HIllary opposed CAFTA and to me was the true stance that Free Trade wasn't working for America. I think this was in 2005 when they voted on it.

I had to do my own research and not rely on this "too good to be true" candidate which is an accurate statement. I believe he jumped on HIllary's stances and knew she was going to run. IMO, that's a con man. Look at Rezko and his bad choices of praising a church. His church didn't convince me, it was the lies the media neglected to point out. He was quoted to say, he passed his own Nuclear waste leak bill (green votes) which he didn't. He lied about being a key person in Chris Dodd's immigration bill (Hispanic votes), and his true stance on the war. These are just a few things but by December 2007, I switched to HIllary and had realized she was the best candidate.

His true stance on the Iraq War has been bloated to the extent that was the reason for many to vote for him. But if you look at http://socialistworker.org/2008/06/04/will-obama-stop-the-war, you will see that they quote from his site, he plans to increase military. For what? Why would you increase the military unless you plan to continue the fight in IRAQ. He even stated, our focus needs to be in Afghanistan. Well ,that surely isn't a halt to this war.

What put me over the edge to vote for McCain instead of Obama was the key backers in pushing MI/FL primary dates defying DNC.

They were Obama elected officials and campaign mgrs.

Obama's Backers - and the Road to the Nomination

The DNC critique of Florida's noncompliance included a reference to the fact that a Democratic state senator was the initial sponsor of the move-up bill in that house, which was seen as a sign of eagerness on the part of some Democratic leaders to break the rules. That senator was Jeremy Ring, an Obama supporter. Obama even named Ring's 2006 campaign manager to run his statewide Florida effort. Ring was such a champion of the early primary that when Obama, like all the other candidates, supported the sanctions and agreed not to campaign in the state, Ring withdrew his endorsement.

When Governor Crist signed the bill at a ceremony in West Palm Beach, the man at his side was Bob Wexler, the chair of Obama's Florida campaign. Wexler wasn't there because he wanted to defy Howard Dean. He was there for the same reason that almost all the Democrats in the legislature voted for the bill. He is the state's leading foe of paperless voting systems and filed two suits against them. He saw the bill as the governor's fulfillment of a campaign pledge "to make Florida a model state for the nation in terms of our election system."

Similarly, all three of the House Democrats who endorsed Obama - Coleman Young II, Bert Johnson, and Aldo Vagnozzi - voted in favor of the bill to push the Michigan date forward. When Obama later took his name off the Michigan ballot, Young and Johnson became sponsors of the bill to cancel the election they had just voted to authorize.

ddprice

06-12-2008, 11:46 AM

I have found actual proof that Obama really is a post turtle. Check this out:

http://www.cadapplet.com/FavoriteCartoons/FavoriteCartoon2.htm

Alessandro Machi

06-18-2008, 02:23 AM

.....But then Obama took his name off the ballot for the Michigan primary. That's when I realized that Obama's talk about change was (and is) nothing but talk. When he had an opportunity to take a stand and go against the establishment, he did exactly what the establishment wanted him to do. And the DNC has rewarded him for it.

Since then, Obama has said and done other things that confirmed my decision not to vote for him. But it all started when he took his name off the ballot in Michigan. That was the deal breaker for me.

Especially when you realize it was done as part of a "deal" between himself, Edwards and Richardson, as they all took off their names on the final day, final afternoon one could do it.

To see this guy go back to Michigan and try and buddy up with Michigan people makes me cringe with embarrassment. The crazy part is I think he definitely has a die hard following in Michigan. I don't believe it's 50% of the democrats however. I think if he went head to head against Hillary he would lose by about a 56-44% margin.

lol, which pretty much means Hillary owns all the swing states that really matter.

efemall

08-01-2008, 05:04 AM

I was a community organizer too... with my LEGOs when I was 5. That atleast qualifies me for secretary of state. donchathink?

Moon Child

09-05-2008, 02:33 PM

The very first time I saw him, he gave off this "messiah" vibe that turned me off. The speech he gave sounded so self important. And the media was all over it!

I was certain I had never seen a more despicable American politician ever the day afterwards, when he was all over the news.

movingtous

09-05-2008, 02:53 PM

The word "change" over-used. I get so sick of hearing this word. It's like a broken record that keeps skipping over that word. I don't know about you all, but I cringe every time they utter that word, like it's something NEW.

Change is CONSTANT.

ChiTownGirl2020

09-08-2008, 06:36 AM

:( In case you haven't guessed by the name, I LIVE IN IL...

I was born/raised on the south-side of Chicago. I KNOW Obama has never done diddly-squat to change IL for the betterment of the people.

I'm a multi-ethnic woman, twice adopted/twice abused. My father was a Navy-man of 23 years and my brother was killed in Vietnam before turning 21. I'm a single mother of six sons [also multi-ethnic] four adopted. I've known about Obama from the very beginning.

How do I KNOW Obama is the biggest LIE that ever was American politics? Let me count the ways.

The 'theme' of the DNC's convention, day one, with Michelle-O, was "Come Back to the Community." Allmy south-side Chicago community ever gave me was hellish-nightmares, that have lasted a lifetime. :mad:

FACTS:

I had to teach my children, before age of 4, in order to play outside:
"Not IF but WHEN you hear gunshots, if they sound real-close, get down and crawl underneath/behind something and if they sound like they're coming, RUN and get inside somewhere quick!" :confused:

The same [MO] community she told America to come back to violated my different-world with multiple rapes. Four different times, committed by four different individuals, in four different places, twice-snatched off the street, but ALL happened on the south-side of Chicago. I once was robbed at gun-point walking my pre-schooler through Garfield Park @ 55th in the middle of the day, in front of my 3 year old, who said, "Mommy...the man had a gun! I saw it! I was scared!" My children & I witnessed two murders on my street corner right off of 51st and Aberdeen before my oldest was 8. And who can forget about that old-school Chicago thug mentality that gets embeded in the majority of men as little boys who grow up to leave girls like me badly bruised, battered, tired and weary or half-dead w/ broken bones, lying in a hospital bed and fighting to escape the pain & misery. :eek:

I survived my south-side of Chicago. Didn't need no house to tell me, I got O-U-T on my own. But my reward for the greatest escape of my life was impending, major health issues like heart disease [from years of excessive stresses/traumas] and breast cancer, probably in-part due to some neurological break-down caused by stress. One of the biggest killers in ethnic geneology is stress. High blood pressure, stroke, heart attack and the rest. My momma used to say, "Stress will KILL YOU, if you let it." I couldn't grasp exactly what she meant, until it was too-late to reverse the damage stress had already done to my nerves and my sanity. :(

I was BLESSED BY MISFORTUNE. One of the BEST things that ever happened in my life began when I was only 5. Abandoned at 2, orphaned until 5 and twice adopted/twice abused before age 9. NEVER had a single, loving, physical-person as a little girl or a daughter. Not one human being tried saving me. So, when I started reading my children's bible at the tender age of 5, the scriptures comforted me. I am a living example of the truth in the unauthored story called, 'Footprints in the Sand'...when no one else was there and I could NOT care for myself, God carried me through every step of everyday. :)

How do I KNOW Obama is the biggest LIE that ever was American Politics?

If the Obama's had ever lived on the REAL south-side of Chicago, neither of them could have survived. Those mean-hard-south-side-Chicago-streets would have swallowed them BOTH whole, chewed them up and spit them out like Moby D.

If there's one thing I do KNOW for certain, it's the south-side of the city of Chi-Town and I KNOW the BIGGEST LIE the O's EVER TOLD was claiming to have changed MY south-side Chicago community. Cause IF they had ever been, MO would have NEVER told ME at the DNC to Come Back to MY Community. :mad: :( :confused: :eek:

[B]DO YOUR HOMEWORK ON THE SOUTH-SIDE OF CHICAGO! TRUTH IS ALL AROUND IF YOU DARE TO LOOK.

YouTube - Barack Obama Talks South Side in Fort Worth, TX

YouTube - Michelle Obama 2008 DNC speaks about family on South Side