Thoughts about how to re-ignite the forum?

[CGP]

Closing the forum twice now has clearly been a blow to forum usership & traffic flow. That goes without saying.

Do you have any ideas/thoughts about how to re-ignite HCF & bring it back to life? I am glad to see some people have returned tonight after I sent out a few emails. And hopefully over time others will visit and see that we are posting again & join in.

Beyond that, however, there is a need to think about the braoder aim/focus/purpose of HCF. Once that is a little more clear, it will help with re-marketing it again.

For me, I want to see the forum remain on pro-Hillary content with regular news/updates on her activities.

As for supporters of other candidates/parties, they should be allowed to participate also (as was the case Nov/Dec 08) as this will make all political discussions that much more interesting & rounded. That obviously includes both supporters & non-supporters of Obama. It's not reasonable or helpful to exclude either group.

So my wish is to see HCF re-become a hub for all things Hillary with an added focus on general political issues involving discussion with people of all political persuasions (& not just those one may agree with).

[xfiles]

I agree as long as debate and discussion can focus on topics and not on individual posters. It is possible to criticize a post or rebut it without getting nasty and personal. :) It keeps the forum more credible and professional too to strive for no personal attacks.

Closing the forum twice now has clearly been a blow to forum usership & traffic flow. That goes without saying.

Do you have any ideas/thoughts about how to re-ignite HCF & bring it back to life? I am glad to see some people have returned tonight after I sent out a few emails. And hopefully over time others will visit and see that we are posting again & join in.

Beyond that, however, there is a need to think about the braoder aim/focus/purpose of HCF. Once that is a little more clear, it will help with re-marketing it again.

For me, I want to see the forum remain on pro-Hillary content with regular news/updates on her activities.

As for supporters of other candidates/parties, they should be allowed to participate also (as was the case Nov/Dec 08) as this will make all political discussions that much more interesting & rounded. That obviously includes both supporters & non-supporters of Obama. It's not reasonable or helpful to exclude either group.

So my wish is to see HCF re-become a hub for all things Hillary with an added focus on general political issues involving discussion with people of all political persuasions (& not just those one may agree with).

[CGP]

I agree as long as debate and discussion can focus on topics and not on individual posters. It is possible to criticize a post or rebut it without getting nasty and personal. :) It keeps the forum more credible and professional too to strive for no personal attacks.

Yes, agreed.

Unfotunately for you, however, some of your views/opinions arouse strong reactions in others.

[MrSandMan]

My concern is investing my time, energy and my own creditability to recommend the site to friends, family, and piers only to see the site shut down again.

This is twice since I've been a member here that the entire forum goes on lock down. What are your long-term plans with the forum? Is opening up another temp thing? Are you leaving it HCF or merging into CommonGround.net?

Haha, my favorite commercial is on... "ShamWoW!"

"You're gonna spend $20 a month on paper towels - you're throwing your money away." Who the hell spends $20 a month on paper towels? What kind of house of horrors are you living in that you are dropping $20 a month on paper towels?? -sheesh. lol

/rant

[CGP]

Yes, I know...

[VotingHillary]

Yes, agreed.

Unfotunately for you, however, some of your views/opinions arouse strong reactions in others.

yep, that is what turned me off the last time...the drama folks have to be banned. This is a pro-Hillary site, period.

[ZY123]

yep, that is what turned me off the last time...the drama folks have to be banned. This is a pro-Hillary site, period.

I'm definitely not into reading anything too focused on how horrible Obama is or how great Obama is for that matter or anything too conservative.

[Spang]

yep, that is what turned me off the last time...the drama folks have to be banned. This is a pro-Hillary site, period.

I agree. If I'm one of them, so be it. :cool:

[Horizon]

I think if this is now a pro Hillary site, we should be focused on what she's doing, and the issues that are important to her, the things that have brought her this far. At some point, Obama will have to be discussed, but I am personally SICK of the B.C. issue,and all the rest of the theories that have surrounded he and his family and associates. I am tired of the hate and prefer to focus on the positive. After all, he did invite her to be SoS. I'm not saying that I love him, or that anyone should love him, I'm just tired of all the bashing. I would like to see this be a more positive, and productive place. No matter who you supported,voted for, or worship.

[ZY123]

M-

Are you thinking more like Common Ground or more like the original HCF?

[CGP]

M-

Are you thinking more like Common Ground or more like the original HCF?

You think I know??!! :eek:

[RE:]

You think I know??!! :eek:You were adamant, at one time, to not focus on the politician but to focus on the politics. So...what exactly do you see doing with this site now? I'm kind of confused by the reopening.

[VotingHillary]

You think I know??!! :eek:

Considering your avatar, I am thinking maybe the original HCF? (fingers crossed)

[MrSandMan]

Either way, I don't see any reason why HCF can't also be a common ground forum. After all, HCF has a large number of registered conservative members... while Hill and Bill are both Democrat, that's a start of common ground, imo.

[CGP]

You were adamant, at one time, to not focus on the politician but to focus on the politics. So...what exactly do you see doing with this site now? I'm kind of confused by the reopening.

With Hillary in the news as SoS I have wanted to discuss that. And also the Kirsten Gillibrand selection. And also some of the current political issues (eg Gitmo etc).

So probably this:

(1) Hillary Clinton
(2) General political discussions

[CGP]

Either way, I don't see any reason why HCF can't also be a common ground forum.

Agreed. It doesn't need to be either or.

It can be HCF with an inclusive format.

[xfiles]

Well, it may be unfortunate for me but it isn't fair. Some others' posts arouse strong reactions in me & others too but I have always tried to keep it civilized. There is nothing wrong with strong reactions as long as people realize as you've said, this is just a forum and not to take things quite so seriously.

Yes, agreed.

Unfotunately for you, however, some of your views/opinions arouse strong reactions in others.

[ZY123]

You think I know??!! :eek:


LOL...I think that would be the first important decision...saying it can be both is kinda like that commercial where the guy wants to go to the airport and downtown at the same time. It can be one thing with another secondary thing though.

[CGP]

It can be one thing with another secondary thing though.

I would say that's what it is.

1. Hillary Clinton
2. General political discussions

It can never be the original HCF as that excluded Obama supporters.

And it won't be CGP as I am not changing the name/domain.

So it will be something in between both - retaining a focus on HC (as an organizing principle) but including broader discussions about all political issues/viewpoints.

[ZY123]

I would say that's what it is.

1. Hillary Clinton
2. General political discussions

It can never be the original HCF as that excluded Obama supporters.

And it won't be CGP as I am not changing the name/domain.

So it will be something in between both - retaining a focus on HC (as an organizing principle) but including broader discussions about all political issues/viewpoints.

so not liberal leaning nor conservative leaning but all then?

[CGP]

so not liberal leaning nor conservative leaning but all then?

Liberal leaning, given that's what HC is.

But conservatives can obviously still participate in the broader discussions.

(Unless it's the rabid anti-gay stuff, which obviously I can't deal with).

[Kbentleyis]

I believe this forum will find it's own level of topics. Pro-Hillary, but all current events and people that influence our government. We are all part of that government and should be aware of issues.

At one time, media and blogs came here to get information.

[ZY123]

(Unless it's the rabid anti-gay stuff, which obviously I can't deal with).

I won't let any of that happen without a fight...if I sit back and say nothing I feel I condone it...

[CGP]

I won't let any of that happen without a fight...if I sit back and say nothing I feel I condone it...

Appreciated!

[Horizon]

I won't let any of that happen without a fight...if I sit back and say nothing I feel I condone it...

STAMP!!!! Not up for discussion, PERIOD!

[ZY123]

Appreciated!

It's just what's right. ;)

[foxyladi]

You think I know??!! :eek:

lol.....

[Ikasu]

I think the forum should go back to its roots, the original HCF -- pro-Hillary focus, but not excluding Obama supporters.

[BrettSta]

I think pro-Hillary, but since the primary and general elections are over, and Obama is no longer her opponent, it should not be a place to throw around every possible anti-Obama item that can be found on the Internet. Obama and Hillary are on the same team, working towards the same goals, so attempts to tear down Obama are in some cases going to indirectly be contrary to Hillary's goals.

[PCFS1]

Considering your avatar, I am thinking maybe the original HCF? (fingers crossed)
Yes it would be a tribute to Hillary. Sec. of State is going to be a very interesting journey. I hope it's HRC.

[Folamix]

I believe this forum will find it's own level of topics. Pro-Hillary, but all current events and people that influence our government. We are all part of that government and should be aware of issues.

At one time, media and blogs came here to get information.

Agreed. With the caveat that I am sick of the Obama bashing. He is the POTUS. Some of the other sites degenerated to unnecessary cattiness which I find distasteful. There are so many issues to be discussed.

[foxyladi]

still HILLARY..

[Horizon]

Murray, as long as you have the same posters posting the same anti ANYTHING President Obama, this is never going to be any different than it was before you closed it. Just my opinion. This morning, it looks like a side room at the Village, and not someplace that I think I would feel comfortable on a day to day basis. People are forgetting who has placed Hillary as SoS and that credit should be given where credit is due. He has not put in place one policy that any Hillary supporter can not be proud of, and I for one, am quite impressed with what he has accomplished to date, as I'm sure Hillary is. She sure looks happy these days......

[Suzan]

He has not put in place one policy that any Hillary supporter can not be proud of, and I for one, am quite impressed with what he has accomplished to date, as I'm sure Hillary is. She sure looks happy these days......


Hmmm ... that's a pretty sweeping statement. I'm also pleased that Hillary is looking happy these days and I think, given the chance, she's going to be a brilliant SOS. Re Obama, it's a wait and see for rme. I've heard all the talk. Now I want to see what he's going to do. It's early, but generally, I'm happy with what he's done so far. I'm a fiscal conservative, so I have some reservations about the bailout package, and I don't agree with the emissions restrictions he's just approved for socal. The auto companies don't need another burden right now. I think the timing on that is wrong, and I'm wondering why he did it now.

Sometimes I actually wish I hadn't gone through the primaries because knowing what I know now about the process, it's hard to have faith in any politician.

Sorry, I think that was totally off topic. Re HCF, I like the focus on Hillary and general political stuff. I'd also like a nonpartisan watchdog focus on all our politicans and the media because I don't think we're going to get that from the MSM. I'm not sure how this would work since the group has no particular political agenda, but maybe that's a plus. And it would lead to lots of discussion.

[SoCal4Hillary]

My concern is investing my time, energy and my own creditability to recommend the site to friends, family, and piers only to see the site shut down again.

This is twice since I've been a member here that the entire forum goes on lock down. What are your long-term plans with the forum? Is opening up another temp thing?My feelings exactly. Murray, you're going to have to decide what the hell you want to do with this place and then stick to it. It's unfair to everyone to open, shut down, reopen, shut down, reopen...and then what? I think SandMan's point is right on target--how many of us want to invest our time, energy, credibility, and effort in resurrecting this site if we're constantly worrying that it'll shut down again?

I think more than anything you need to address this, perhaps in a separate thread, so your intentions are clear and known.

You know I love this place, but the roller coaster ride is getting to be a bit much. :eek:
Haha, my favorite commercial is on... "ShamWoW!"

"You're gonna spend $20 a month on paper towels - you're throwing your money away." Who the hell spends $20 a month on paper towels? What kind of house of horrors are you living in that you are dropping $20 a month on paper towels?? -sheesh. lolMy favorite part? "Cause we can't do this all day..." :rolleyes:

[CGP]

I think pro-Hillary, but since the primary and general elections are over, and Obama is no longer her opponent, it should not be a place to throw around every possible anti-Obama item that can be found on the Internet. Obama and Hillary are on the same team, working towards the same goals, so attempts to tear down Obama are in some cases going to indirectly be contrary to Hillary's goals.

This seems reasonable to me...

[G'aal]

I think pro-Hillary, but since the primary and general elections are over, and Obama is no longer her opponent, it should not be a place to throw around every possible anti-Obama item that can be found on the Internet. Obama and Hillary are on the same team, working towards the same goals, so attempts to tear down Obama are in some cases going to indirectly be contrary to Hillary's goals.

Agreed. If there is going to be something along the lines of "Common Ground Politics" coming later (a different forum altogether), then this one should stick to its roots, with the understanding that all are welcome as long as they aren't starting fights. Really, that's the general rule of any good message board. HCF's focus in its heyday was fine, except for the zero tolerance of anything other than rabid pro-Hillary/anti-Obama thinking.

Thus, pro-Hillaryism should be strongly promoted, but anti-Obama (other than "proper" critcism one would see in any free speech forum) jingoism should not be tolerated. This site should lift up whenever possible, not tear down.

[ZY123]

Agreed. If there is going to be something along the lines of "Common Ground Politics" coming later (a different forum altogether),

Or it could be this forum...I just noticed that HCF Admin is CGP...so we'll have to wait and see.

[Horizon]

Thoughts about how to re-ignite the forum?

By not postinghttp://i489.photobucket.com/albums/rr254/Bitchmom67/Funnies/shit_.gif!!

[ZY123]

Thoughts about how to re-ignite the forum?

By not postinghttp://i489.photobucket.com/albums/rr254/Bitchmom67/Funnies/shit_.gif!!

OK...now I'm rolling laughing! HAHAHAHAHAHAHA....we need that smile on here!

[Horizon]

Thoughts about how to re-ignite the forum?

By not postinghttp://i489.photobucket.com/albums/rr254/Bitchmom67/Funnies/shit_.gif!!

OK...now I'm rolling laughing! HAHAHAHAHAHAHA....we need that smile on here!

Excuse us, we're http://i489.photobucket.com/albums/rr254/Bitchmom67/Funnies/shots.gifhttp://i489.photobucket.com/albums/rr254/Bitchmom67/Funnies/beer9.gif

[Alessandro Machi]

I don't have any ideas at this point in time.

I have this forum linked at the top of http://www.DailyPUMA.com

[Laura Cereta]

I think the forum should go back to its roots, the original HCF -- pro-Hillary focus, but not excluding Obama supporters.

The original HCF worked better for me personally. What's done is done, and I certainly think it's fine to look at both the positives and the negatives of the BO administration (I'll even name a positive-- closing Gitmo. :)) but... most hard-core BO supporters will defend EVERYTHING he does. Just for the sake of total honesty, they are hard to live with, or should I say blog with... or are those two things different? ;)

[xfiles]

Very true. Not being an extremist goes BOTH ways! Some define extremist as criticizing Obama but don't define extremist as supporting almost every single thing he does or says. Closing Gitmo is fine but what are the plans for the prisoners? Let them lose in the US or their own countries to be involved in terrorism again? That is a criticism I have of the *administration.:mad:


The original HCF worked better for me personally. What's done is done, and I certainly think it's fine to look at both the positives and the negatives of the BO administration (I'll even name a positive-- closing Gitmo. :)) but... most hard-core BO supporters will defend EVERYTHING he does. Just for the sake of total honesty, they are hard to live with, or should I say blog with... or are those two things different? ;)

[thebword]

Closing the forum twice now has clearly been a blow to forum usership & traffic flow. That goes without saying.

Do you have any ideas/thoughts about how to re-ignite HCF & bring it back to life? I am glad to see some people have returned tonight after I sent out a few emails. And hopefully over time others will visit and see that we are posting again & join in.

Beyond that, however, there is a need to think about the braoder aim/focus/purpose of HCF. Once that is a little more clear, it will help with re-marketing it again.

For me, I want to see the forum remain on pro-Hillary content with regular news/updates on her activities.

As for supporters of other candidates/parties, they should be allowed to participate also (as was the case Nov/Dec 08) as this will make all political discussions that much more interesting & rounded. That obviously includes both supporters & non-supporters of Obama. It's not reasonable or helpful to exclude either group.

So my wish is to see HCF re-become a hub for all things Hillary with an added focus on general political issues involving discussion with people of all political persuasions (& not just those one may agree with).

Should anyone who did NOT receive an email interpret that to mean they were NOT welcomed back, or just not your favorites? If that is not what you meant to tell the rest of us, maybe the way to re-ignite (which implies get back what you lost, not start over new - IMO) the HCF you need to APOLOGIZE, FOCUS on what you want for your Forum, create the RULES, and do a blanket EMAIL to ALL of your past HCF members.

The bottom line here CGP, is you need to gain back your creditability to lead and administer this Forum. You could start with an apology, you lost a lot of members with your behavior concerning the shut downs. If you truly want to re-ignite you must regain their trust. You must earn it back and an apology would go a long way. Write up a brief email, and hit send all. Then wait and see what happens.

I'm sorry if offended you with my words, but I'm not the sycophant type. I'm not looking to be your yes man. The honest truth is - YOU need to do some work CGP. You need to win back the members who made the HCF the success it was before. You lead us there, but they are the ones that made this place informative, intelligent, respectful, classy, and great. Your Forum needs them more then they need your Forum.

.

[ZY123]

The original HCF worked better for me personally. What's done is done, and I certainly think it's fine to look at both the positives and the negatives of the BO administration (I'll even name a positive-- closing Gitmo. :)) but... most hard-core BO supporters will defend EVERYTHING he does. Just for the sake of total honesty, they are hard to live with, or should I say blog with... or are those two things different? ;)

Honestly I think it's very hard if not impossible to go back, too many things have happened and too much has changed (for me anyway that's true). The old HCF can never be again...it just won't feel the same not to me. A lot of things are about timing....but even after Plan B I don't think it was possible to journey backwards....so it has to be something different IMO....what I have no idea.

[CGP]

Should anyone who did NOT receive an email interpret that to mean they were NOT welcomed back, or just not your favorites?

No, it wasn't like that at all. There was no selection of favorites...

I simply did a quick browse through of threads that were active prior to closure on 12/12/08 and emailed people who had posted in those threads. I didn't do a thorough search as it was very time-consuming to do. I just wanted to get enough people posting to create activity such that when other people visited (those who I didn't get a chance to email) would join in.

As is often the case in this life, people make complex interpretations when there isn't any need or basis to do so.

If anyone didn't receive an email, don't take it personally - I only emailed a small group of people to get the forum active again & hoped that everyone else would then join in. I hadn't counted on people getting upset that they didn't receive an email...For the majority of people who didn't get an email - my apologies if that made you feel left out.

[mcgowan.swan]

Honestly I think it's very hard if not impossible to go back, too many things have happened and too much has changed (for me anyway that's true). The old HCF can never be again...it just won't feel the same not to me. A lot of things are about timing....but even after Plan B I don't think it was possible to journey backwards....so it has to be something different IMO....what I have no idea.

stamp.... it should be something to do with hillary, but different from the original hcf. that board is now holding it's place in history, as well it should. we are now in limbo and searching for a new direction. i think that direction will evolve naturally out of the posters already here, but that is definitely a very slow method of gaining momentum and guidance.

sadly, i have no alternative to offer at this moment. there are a lot of very intelligent posters here. i am sure between those posters and muzza, a new direction and the outlets to push the forum forward will be found. :)

[WhatDidWeDo]

Agreed. If there is going to be something along the lines of "Common Ground Politics" coming later (a different forum altogether), then this one should stick to its roots, with the understanding that all are welcome as long as they aren't starting fights. Really, that's the general rule of any good message board. HCF's focus in its heyday was fine, except for the zero tolerance of anything other than rabid pro-Hillary/anti-Obama thinking.

Thus, pro-Hillaryism should be strongly promoted, but anti-Obama (other than "proper" critcism one would see in any free speech forum) jingoism should not be tolerated. This site should lift up whenever possible, not tear down.

The people who want an exclusively pro-Left forum are going to go to DemocraticUnderground or DailyKos. The people who want an exclusively pro-Right forum are going to go to FreeRepublic. What attracted me here was a forum where moderates on both sides of the divide could chat in a civil manner.

[Alessandro Machi]

What has not been mentioned is how in the tank MSNBC is. This is really a big deal and unfortunately is one that causes confusion as to how to deal with each event that comes up.

It becomes almost impossible to be a Barack Obama supporter yet know how to discern MSNBC's pro Obama 24/7 stance.

[G'aal]

The people who want an exclusively pro-Left forum are going to go to DemocraticUnderground or DailyKos. The people who want an exclusively pro-Right forum are going to go to FreeRepublic. What attracted me here was a forum where moderates on both sides of the divide could chat in a civil manner.

Actually, I agree. The difficulty is in merging the old HCF with the new one. I'm a moderate myself, and frankly prefer the forum as it is now, even though many of the rabid old-timers have gone away.

I do think there's something to paying homage to history, however, and HCF's primary history is as a pro-Hillary site. Thus, I believe it should remain pro-Hillary, but encouraging of multiple points of view. I think Murray's done a very good job balancing the two notions.

[thebword]

Actually, I agree. The difficulty is in merging the old HCF with the new one. I'm a moderate myself, and frankly prefer the forum as it is now, even though many of the rabid old-timers have gone away.

I do think there's something to paying homage to history, however, and HCF's primary history is as a pro-Hillary site. Thus, I believe it should remain pro-Hillary, but encouraging of multiple points of view. I think Murray's done a very good job balancing the two notions.

How can I re-ignite the HCF? Any thoughts?

http://tbn3.google.com/images?q=tbn:ZrvHPpdTnHKrtM:http://www.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/344522/2/istockphoto_344522-mad-old-lady.jpg

Well, for one you could start sticking up for your "rabid old-timers" who put your Forum on the map. A little less of throwing us under the bus and a little more acknowledgment that it was those "rabid old-timers" who were the heart and soul of HCF. You, Murray were not a solo act, maybe your "young whipper snappers" need that pointed out to them. The "rabid old-timers" and their many hours of dedication to create thoughtful, intelligent, respectful, profanity free, threads and posts are what created the atmosphere that stood out from the rest of the political Forums.

Most Forums, especially political ones, show their members immaturity in their simplified, black or white, views on issues and how they express them. The HCF showed the maturity of the "rabid old-timers",. They saw the many shades of gray in the issues, and were able to discuss them in a respectful intelligent manner.

Now, Murray, you seem determined to either ban, push out, or allow the "rabid old-timers" to be bullied out and feel unwelcome at the Forum they had an important roll in creating. Very shabby treatment indeed.

If you want to re-ignite the HCF, Murray, you can't get rid of the spark that ignited the original fire. Have you not figured that out yet? You re-opened AGAIN - enthusiasm high, "rabid old-timers" hopeful, your numbers were pretty good given the history, and now they are nearly non-existent. AGIAN you need the "rabid old-timers" at your Forum, more then the "rabid old-timers" need your Forum.

By the way, "young whipper snappers", by your standards Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton would be a "rabid old-timer" too. She also sees the many facets to every issue. She uses well thought out intelligent words to express her thoughts -- Free from profanity. So I've got to ask myself; how much of a Hillary Rodham Clinton fan are you really?

.

.

[SoCal4Hillary]

What has not been mentioned is how in the tank MSNBC is. This is really a big deal and unfortunately is one that causes confusion as to how to deal with each event that comes up.

It becomes almost impossible to be a Barack Obama supporter yet know how to discern MSNBC's pro Obama 24/7 stance.Very good points.

[SoCal4Hillary]

How can I re-ignite the HCF? Any thoughts?

http://tbn3.google.com/images?q=tbn:ZrvHPpdTnHKrtM:http://www.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/344522/2/istockphoto_344522-mad-old-lady.jpg

Well, for one you could start sticking up for your "rabid old-timers" who put your Forum on the map.Murray didn't write that. :eek: What's funny is that I thought he did, too, when I read that particular reply, then did a double-take and scrolled back up to see who the author was.

[Folamix]

One thing I think you need to do is address the closing and reopening of the forum twice. People are willing to let it go the first time but twice, in a short period of time. Folks are hesitant to invest their time, money and commitment to something that comes across as wishy-washy and unstable.

I am sorry if this is offensive, but I think that is a very important thing that needs to be addressed

[Aria]

I think that the people who are concerned about whether the forum will indeed stay open this time 'round do have a point - however, nothing is certain in this world, so perhaps it's unfair and unrealistic to try to pin Murray down to a definitive answer on that. To my recollection, he has given adequate reasons for the closings, and the re-openings. Naturally, we were disappointed with the closings and felt let down, but we need to remember that we are essentially guests here and our host needs to be treated with some understanding and respect. Certainly a forum cannot be successful without contributors, but no one contributes more time and energy than the administrator, who also has to figure out how to deal with the problems that occur.

HCF can never be what it was to begin with, simply because the "reason for being" is no longer the same. That's a fact. Some may want to return to the excitement of those days, and some won't let go of the negatives that developed - but there's no point in trying to live in the past. We need to build, on the past and the present, for the future.

It is a new HC Forum, and there's much to be excited about with Hillary in her new position. She can still benefit from knowing of our support, and I bet that she knows. It's time to stop second-guessing and just get on with it. Be happy with what it is - for as long as it is. We've talked the "reasons for being" into the ground when considering the switch to Common Ground Politics. Perhaps a sub-title to Hillary Clinton Forum, using the term "common ground" would still be a good idea. It might be inviting to a broader scope of people, and may also indicate a place of respectful, civil discussion.

Just my thoughts at the moment.

[CGP]

I think that the people who are concerned about whether the forum will indeed stay open this time 'round do have a point - however, nothing is certain in this world, so perhaps it's unfair and unrealistic to try to pin Murray down to a definitive answer on that. To my recollection, he has given adequate reasons for the closings, and the re-openings. Naturally, we were disappointed with the closings and felt let down, but we need to remember that we are essentially guests here and our host needs to be treated with some understanding and respect. Certainly a forum cannot be successful without contributors, but no one contributes more time and energy than the administrator, who also has to figure out how to deal with the problems that occur.

HCF can never be what it was to begin with, simply because the "reason for being" is no longer the same. That's a fact. Some may want to return to the excitement of those days, and some won't let go of the negatives that developed - but there's no point in trying to live in the past. We need to build, on the past and the present, for the future.

It is a new HC Forum, and there's much to be excited about with Hillary in her new position. She can still benefit from knowing of our support, and I bet that she knows. It's time to stop second-guessing and just get on with it. Be happy with what it is - for as long as it is. We've talked the "reasons for being" into the ground when considering the switch to Common Ground Politics. Perhaps a sub-title to Hillary Clinton Forum, using the term "common ground" would still be a good idea. It might be inviting to a broader scope of people, and may also indicate a place of respectful, civil discussion.

Just my thoughts at the moment.

Thanks for your understanding & for being so very reasonable. :cool:

[CGP]

Now, Murray, you seem determined to either ban, push out, or allow the "rabid old-timers" to be bullied out and feel unwelcome at the Forum they had an important roll in creating. Very shabby treatment indeed.

If you want to re-ignite the HCF, Murray, you can't get rid of the spark that ignited the original fire. Have you not figured that out yet? You re-opened AGAIN - enthusiasm high, "rabid old-timers" hopeful, your numbers were pretty good given the history, and now they are nearly non-existent. AGIAN you need the "rabid old-timers" at your Forum, more then the "rabid old-timers" need your Forum.
.

Actually, that's not the case at all. Don't believe everything third parties tell you! Apart from a couple of exclusions here and there (for reasons obvious to all), most people in the "rabid old-timers" category have moved on by virtue of their own decisions/choices & because of disapproval of the forum's direction. People are free to participate wherever they like. If HCF is no longer a place they want to post, that's just the way it is. Many of the original HCF remain very opposed to Obama and are not impressed with my willingness to allow Obama supporters to post here. So be it.

[CGP]

Actually, I agree. The difficulty is in merging the old HCF with the new one. I'm a moderate myself, and frankly prefer the forum as it is now, even though many of the rabid old-timers have gone away.

I do think there's something to paying homage to history, however, and HCF's primary history is as a pro-Hillary site. Thus, I believe it should remain pro-Hillary, but encouraging of multiple points of view. I think Murray's done a very good job balancing the two notions.

Thanks for your participation.

[CGP]

It is a new HC Forum, and there's much to be excited about with Hillary in her new position. She can still benefit from knowing of our support, and I bet that she knows. It's time to stop second-guessing and just get on with it. Be happy with what it is - for as long as it is. We've talked the "reasons for being" into the ground when considering the switch to Common Ground Politics. Perhaps a sub-title to Hillary Clinton Forum, using the term "common ground" would still be a good idea. It might be inviting to a broader scope of people, and may also indicate a place of respectful, civil discussion.

Hopefully some of this is coming true!!

[Lealy]

When the site got shut down the first time I came back around and felt out of place. I think so far the best thing the POTUS has down is appoint HC as SOS, but other than that I don't like anything. In fact I have cried almost daily in the last 2 weeks. I am not a homophobe, racist or completely pro life and I don't want people to suffer but socialism is my worst nightmare for my life and the future of my children. I will read a little more tonight but it seems that it has moved into POTUS IS ALL from the few I have read. I already am scared enough I don't need to read propaganda I get enough of that from the so called news networks. I must say I am also busy reading the spending bill HR1 or what ever they deem it to be today. I will keep my fingers crossed that the site is not so one sided, liberal leaning I can handle socialist I can move to Venezuela for of course I would not have the ability to talk to any anymore.

[CGP]

I will read a little more tonight but it seems that it has moved into POTUS IS ALL from the few I have read.

That would be an extremely inaccurate perception.

But, ultimately, people usually believe that which is consistent with what they want or need to believe.

[VotingHillary]

That would be an extremely inaccurate perception.

I have to agree...out of the first 20 topics on the board...only two even involve Obama.

[Aria]

I will read a little more tonight but it seems that it has moved into POTUS IS ALL from the few I have read. I already am scared enough I don't need to read propaganda I get enough of that from the so called news networks.

Lealy - If you look around a little more, you will find many who agree with you. The important thing is that we agree to disagree in an agreeable manner! I feel that we can't expect our elected politicians to come together and make progress for this country if they can't discuss the issues from their varying points of view in a civil manner. Well, they may not always set an example:rolleyes:, but we can sure try! Seriously, we can't expect it of them if we aren't willing to do it ourselves, imho - and here at the Forum we have the opportunity.:)

[CGP]

I feel that we can't expect our elected politicians to come together and make progress for this country if they can't discuss the issues from their varying points of view in a civil manner. Well, they may not always set an example:rolleyes:, but we can sure try! Seriously, we can't expect it of them if we aren't willing to do it ourselves, imho - and here at the Forum we have the opportunity.:)

An excellent point.

[Gender Neutrality]

Re-ignite it? It's blazing. Let it be. So you closed it down twice. So what? You did. We had to find something else to do, rest our fingers and hopefully our minds. That was good for us. We could re-boot.

Eras of HCF

1. until June, then August: nearly everyone loved nearly everything Hillary did and just about everyone hated nearly everything BO did. 1000s of good points made and 1000s of links. great place to come for news. People began registering as Independents and stopped listening to Air America.

2. until November 4, 10 PM EST : welcomed moderate Reps in and got to know McCain and Palin and opened our minds a bit and learned that all Republicans are not Tom Delay and Mark Foley and Denny Hastert (or are they, I hear someone's voice saying - but no, they're not). Everybody loved some things McCain did and some or most things Palin did and still kinda sorta didn't like BO so much. I guess some people did like him ok, but not much - and you could ignore them without actually using the "Ignore" function. 1000s of good points made and 1000s of links. great place to come for news.

3. until 12/31/08: Some BO supporters rushed in and kinda sorta gloated; some HRC and McPalin supporters got with the program immediately and suddenly liked BO; some said, c'mon, he's gonna be President and you have to respect that; some continued to dislike BO. Prop 8 also became an issue as well as the voting pattern around it. In this breakdown, the posters began to attack one another. Murray tried to keep discussion at an adult level, and some liked that and some wanted to bring it all down to emotions. I only stayed because I learned how to use the official "Ignore" function. Not everyone knew of or used that technique and some got dragged down into childishness. It got icky to be around and Murry had had enough and off turned the lights when Hillary lowered the boom in Times Square, looking radiant. HCF was gone forever.

4. The Dark Ages: We wandered around the internet like zombies, looking for where we could find a treasure trove, a gold mine of links. There was nothing.

5. Late Jan, you either stumbled back or got an email: The lights got turned back on! When Hillary was about to take office, it was too exciting not to see what happens. HCF opened - perhaps despite Murray, and also thanks to Murray.

Intelligent people rally around a bright light like hers. We are they. Use the "Ignore" function if someone's name and avatar irk you. And let's cease ad homiwoman ;) comments.

[CGP]

GN - enjoyed reading your summary!

Do stick around for the next phase, whatever it is! :p

[VotingHillary]

Re-ignite it? It's blazing. Let it be. So you closed it down twice. So what? You did. We had to find something else to do, rest our fingers and hopefully our minds. That was good for us. We could re-boot.

Eras of HCF

1. until June, then August: nearly everyone loved nearly everything Hillary did and just about everyone hated nearly everything BO did. 1000s of good points made and 1000s of links. great place to come for news. People began registering as Independents and stopped listening to Air America.

2. until November 4, 10 PM EST : welcomed moderate Reps in and got to know McCain and Palin and opened our minds a bit and learned that all Republicans are not Tom Delay and Mark Foley and Denny Hastert (or are they, I hear someone's voice saying - but no, they're not). Everybody loved some things McCain did and some or most things Palin did and still kinda sorta didn't like BO so much. I guess some people did like him ok, but not much - and you could ignore them without actually using the "Ignore" function. 1000s of good points made and 1000s of links. great place to come for news.

3. until 12/31/08: Some BO supporters rushed in and kinda sorta gloated; some HRC and McPalin supporters got with the program immediately and suddenly liked BO; some said, c'mon, he's gonna be President and you have to respect that; some continued to dislike BO. Prop 8 also became an issue as well as the voting pattern around it. In this breakdown, the posters began to attack one another. Murray tried to keep discussion at an adult level, and some liked that and some wanted to bring it all down to emotions. I only stayed because I learned how to use the official "Ignore" function. Not everyone knew of or used that technique and some got dragged down into childishness. It got icky to be around and Murry had had enough and off turned the lights when Hillary lowered the boom in Times Square, looking radiant. HCF was gone forever.

4. The Dark Ages: We wandered around the internet like zombies, looking for where we could find a treasure trove, a gold mine of links. There was nothing.

5. Late Jan, you either stumbled back or got an email: The lights got turned back on! When Hillary was about to take office, it was too exciting not to see what happens. HCF opened - perhaps despite Murray, and also thanks to Murray.

Intelligent people rally around a bright light like hers. We are they. Use the "Ignore" function if someone's name and avatar irk you. And let's cease ad homiwoman ;) comments.

This may be the best summation of this forum to date....do you work for Reader's Digest?:D

[Gender Neutrality]

VotingHillary: no, do they have job openings? :p

[hobbitt]

Haha, my favorite commercial is on... "ShamWoW!"

"You're gonna spend $20 a month on paper towels - you're throwing your money away." Who the hell spends $20 a month on paper towels? What kind of house of horrors are you living in that you are dropping $20 a month on paper towels?? -sheesh. lol



We do. This is Seattle. We have rain. Often. We have windows which collect condensation even when it is not raining. We have walls which collect water, and ceilings and countertops and damned near every other surface. And the condensate brings black furry stuff. We use lots of paper towels. But stuff like ShamWow does not appeal - so much better to throw away the gunky paper towels. [And the only 'house of horrors' I know is in Amityville NY. Where paper towels probably don't help.]

And I kinda liked the Forum before it was opened to the Anti-Hillary folks last year. I hope this new incarnation of HCF will be conducive to discussions of current events (and the continued excoriation of hypocritical or lying or incredibly dumb politicians ). I was over at another forum for a while but that was not fun and eventually became overwrought and frenzied and petty.

[CGP]

And I kinda liked the Forum before it was opened to the Anti-Hillary folks last year. I hope this new incarnation of HCF will be conducive to discussions of current events.

Just to clarify, the forum has never been open to anti-hillary folks - trolls are a different story and a few of those managed to get through after the election but they didn't last long before being shown the door. The forum remains as a pro-hillary zone! And yes, the current version of HCF is open to discussions about all kinds of political and news events, and people of all political persuasions can join in.

PS - Good to see you posting again. Your input is always witty and of value!

[sojourner]

C
So my wish is to see HCF re-become a hub for all things Hillary with an added focus on general political issues involving discussion with people of all political persuasions (& not just those one may agree with).

This sounds to me like the original HFC minus being rabidly anti-Obama. Being pro-Hillary is by extension pro-Obama since she is in his administration and implementing his foreign policy. This makes it difficult if not impossible to seek common ground since by definition the forum is skewed to the left, any criticism of Hillary or Obama’s foreign policy being discouraged.

Being pro-Hillary and moving beyond partisanship & seeking common ground are conflicting goals. The best you can do is seek common ground on issues that do not involve Hillary.

Plus, being pro-Hillary is going to discourage center and right of center membership and skew your membership to the left (might be okay if the imbalance is not too great).

I think you have to choose between being Pro-Hillary or being common ground or be mediocre at both.

[CGP]

This sounds to me like the original HFC minus being rabidly anti-Obama. Being pro-Hillary is by extension pro-Obama since she is in his administration and implementing his foreign policy. This makes it difficult if not impossible to seek common ground since by definition the forum is skewed to the left, any criticism of Hillary or Obama’s foreign policy being discouraged.

Being pro-Hillary and moving beyond partisanship & seeking common ground are conflicting goals. The best you can do is seek common ground on issues that do not involve Hillary.

Plus, being pro-Hillary is going to discourage center and right of center membership and skew your membership to the left (might be okay if the imbalance is not too great).

I think you have to choose between being Pro-Hillary or being common ground or be mediocre at both.

I take your points.

And I have considered removing the byline before as there is conflict.

My number one interest for the forum is "pro-hillary".

I am comfortable with membership being skewed to the left as the forum has as its original inspiration, a left-leaning politician.

But the lean to the left hasn't stopped Republicans from participating in recent weeks. And that adds to the debate obviously.

So I see the choice as being between:

1. Pro-Hillary & open to all other points of view

or

2. Pro-Hillary & closed to all other points of view

I think currently the forum is more in category 1 than category 2 given the mix of views being presented.

[Meg]

Re-ignite it? It's blazing. Let it be. So you closed it down twice. So what? You did. We had to find something else to do, rest our fingers and hopefully our minds. That was good for us. We could re-boot.

Eras of HCF

1. until June, then August: nearly everyone loved nearly everything Hillary did and just about everyone hated nearly everything BO did. 1000s of good points made and 1000s of links. great place to come for news. People began registering as Independents and stopped listening to Air America.

2. until November 4, 10 PM EST : welcomed moderate Reps in and got to know McCain and Palin and opened our minds a bit and learned that all Republicans are not Tom Delay and Mark Foley and Denny Hastert (or are they, I hear someone's voice saying - but no, they're not). Everybody loved some things McCain did and some or most things Palin did and still kinda sorta didn't like BO so much. I guess some people did like him ok, but not much - and you could ignore them without actually using the "Ignore" function. 1000s of good points made and 1000s of links. great place to come for news.

3. until 12/31/08: Some BO supporters rushed in and kinda sorta gloated; some HRC and McPalin supporters got with the program immediately and suddenly liked BO; some said, c'mon, he's gonna be President and you have to respect that; some continued to dislike BO. Prop 8 also became an issue as well as the voting pattern around it. In this breakdown, the posters began to attack one another. Murray tried to keep discussion at an adult level, and some liked that and some wanted to bring it all down to emotions. I only stayed because I learned how to use the official "Ignore" function. Not everyone knew of or used that technique and some got dragged down into childishness. It got icky to be around and Murry had had enough and off turned the lights when Hillary lowered the boom in Times Square, looking radiant. HCF was gone forever.

4. The Dark Ages: We wandered around the internet like zombies, looking for where we could find a treasure trove, a gold mine of links. There was nothing.

5. Late Jan, you either stumbled back or got an email: The lights got turned back on! When Hillary was about to take office, it was too exciting not to see what happens. HCF opened - perhaps despite Murray, and also thanks to Murray.

Intelligent people rally around a bright light like hers. We are they. Use the "Ignore" function if someone's name and avatar irk you. And let's cease ad homiwoman ;) comments.


Ok that was beyond perfect! :rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

[Aria]

This sounds to me like the original HFC minus being rabidly anti-Obama. Being pro-Hillary is by extension pro-Obama since she is in his administration and implementing his foreign policy. This makes it difficult if not impossible to seek common ground since by definition the forum is skewed to the left, any criticism of Hillary or Obama’s foreign policy being discouraged.

Being pro-Hillary and moving beyond partisanship & seeking common ground are conflicting goals. The best you can do is seek common ground on issues that do not involve Hillary.

Plus, being pro-Hillary is going to discourage center and right of center membership and skew your membership to the left (might be okay if the imbalance is not too great).

I think you have to choose between being Pro-Hillary or being common ground or be mediocre at both.

I disagree with much of this. It comes down to, if we can't seek common ground here - right here on this forum - how can we expect Hillary/Obama to be seeking common ground around the world? Any opportunity to seek common ground should be valued, not dismissed. And being pro-Hillary does not necessarily mean pro-Obama; as things are now, it means only "wait and see" for some of us. We fully expect that Hillary will play a positive role for this country and administration in her position as SOS, but there could well be times when situations arise that bring questions or consternation and I don't believe that honest discussion or fair criticism of Hillary or Obama will be shoved under the rug at those times. We're not here just to be cheerleaders for the administration.

The title of this site honors Hillary and the original basis of the forum and certainly speaks of support for Hillary in her position as SOS - while the byline invites all, who want to see our country succeed, to discuss the events of the time. I don't see any conflict at all. Hillary's work as SOS requires Seeking Common Ground -Big Time! For all we know, her first job at that may start behind the oval office doors - we can hope that she has influence on the policies as well as the ability to implement them in her trips abroad.

I believe that the byline, "Moving Beyond Partisanship and Seeking Common Ground" has already helped move the forum ahead in its goals of being more inclusive. It's an important statement and people of all persuasions are coming together here for their own personal reasons, be it in support of Hillary's work, the administration's goals, to offer their own views pro and con, or just to stay on top of the current happenings. To me, the byline broadens the purpose of the forum into something more meaningful - and it speaks for Hillary and for all of us. :thumbsup:

[CGP]

I believe that the byline, "Moving Beyond Partisanship and Seeking Common Ground" has already helped move the forum ahead in its goals of being more inclusive. It's an important statement and people of all persuasions are coming together here for their own personal reasons, be it in support of Hillary's work, the administration's goals, to offer their own views pro and con, or just to stay on top of the current happenings. To me, the byline broadens the purpose of the forum into something more meaningful - and it speaks for Hillary and for all of us. :thumbsup:

You made some very good points, especially these!

[lanesharon]

To say that the forum is about 'common ground' is great, but common ground relating to what?:
Economics
Politics
Religion
Social Issues

Common Ground definition: a basis agreed to by all parties for reaching a mutual understanding; premises of an argument that are accepted by both sides of an arguement or dispute; characteristic or interest shared by multiple people or systems.

Somehow, I don't think that what I see on these forums, right now, fits those definitions.

Murray, have you chosen the 'common ground' aspect of the forums. Which issue or entity does everyone here agree upon?

[sojourner]

Women first, country second?

Do you think that the best interest of women and the country are not the same?

By any chance are you a fan of Sheri S. Tepper?

[lanesharon]

Women first, country second?

Do you think that the best interest of women and the country are not the same?

By any chance are you a fan of Sheri S. Tepper?

To you first real question, often I think they are NOT the same.

Second question - Don't know of anyone by that name.

Why do you ask?

[CGP]

To say that the forum is about 'common ground' is great, but common ground relating to what?:
Economics
Politics
Religion
Social Issues

Common Ground definition: a basis agreed to by all parties for reaching a mutual understanding; premises of an argument that are accepted by both sides of an arguement or dispute; characteristic or interest shared by multiple people or systems.

Somehow, I don't think that what I see on these forums, right now, fits those definitions.

Murray, have you chosen the 'common ground' aspect of the forums. Which issue or entity does everyone here agree upon?

LS - the points you raise are important ones. I really don't know the answers at this point. Perhaps one definition of "common ground" that could work is agreeing to respect the opinions of others, even if we may disagree with them. Even that is easier said than done...

[lanesharon]

LS - the points you raise are important ones. I really don't know the answers at this point.

In all honesty, if you really want this to work this time around, you may want to consider it all and at least come up with a central topic or issue. Then you can wrap the discussions and debates around that. If you leave it the way it is, will it just become another 'failed' social network'?

I want you to succeed Murray. Honestly. Or I wouldn't given my input on this.

Every failed corporation lacked an ongoing good business plan and the will to follow it through. Every successful corporation creates a good business plan (when new), modifies it as conditions change, and uses it to direct the corporation. Forums (social networks) are no different.

In any event, applause for trying it again. I know this last go-round was tough on you. Hopefully, 'three times a charm'.

[Aria]

To say that the forum is about 'common ground' is great, but common ground relating to what?: Economics - Politics - Religion - Social Issues.....Common Ground definition: a basis agreed to by all parties for reaching a mutual understanding; premises of an argument that are accepted by both sides of an arguement or dispute; characteristic or interest shared by multiple people or systems.....Somehow, I don't think that what I see on these forums, right now, fits those definitions.....Murray, have you chosen the 'common ground' aspect of the forums. Which issue or entity does everyone here agree upon?

I'd say that the operative word in the byline that you are overlooking is "Seeking" - Seeking Common Ground. I don't see how anyone can have a problem with that. It may seem idealistic or an impossible goal - but the process is a necessity - and is commendable in itself. The effort on the forum is a reflection of what we know must happen on a larger scale - as Hillary, herself, is expressing the need for listening and working together in her meetings with foreign leaders. After all, we are all ON common ground to begin with, and must seek ways to live together peacefully on this earth. And with our nation having become more diverse than ever, we need to start at home, seek the paths of commonality, and tear down the roadblocks of unnecessary prejudices. **==

LS.....Perhaps one definition of "common ground" that could work is agreeing to respect the opinions of others, even if we may disagree with them. Even that is easier said than done...

I think that this forum allows those, who recognize the need for knowledge and understanding as a basis for attaining common ground, to come together in its pursuit. And in that effort, we may achieve a higher ground as individuals - not as a lofty goal, but as a by-product of participation. :)

[CGP]

This thread was relevant on Jan 26. But not so much on March 7.

Enough good points have been made for us to move on to a new topic.

So I am closing this one! ;)