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View Full Version : (9/21/09) Strangers to Dissent, Liberals Try to Stifle It (Townhall)


Valin
09-21-2009, 10:37 AM
Townhall (http://townhall.com/columnists/MichaelBarone/2009/09/21/strangers_to_dissent,_liberals_try_to_stifle_it?pa ge=full)

It is an interesting phenomenon that the response of the left half of our political spectrum to criticism and argument is often to try to shut it down. Thus President Obama in his Sept. 9 speech to a joint session of Congress told us to stop "bickering," as if principled objections to major changes in public policy were just childish obstinacy, and chastised his critics for telling "lies," employing "scare tactics" and playing "games." Unlike his predecessor, he sought to use the prestige of his office to shut criticism down.

Now, no one likes criticism very much, and most politicians would prefer to have their colleagues and constituents meekly and gratefully agree with them on pretty much everything. And yes, Rep. Joe Wilson did seem to have broken the rules and standards of decorum of the House (though not of the British House of Commons) when he shouted, "You lie!" in the middle of Obama's speech.

But none of this justifies the charges, passed off as cool-headed analysis, that Obama's critics are motivated by racism. There are plenty of non-racist reasons to oppose (or to support) the Democrats' health care proposals.
I would submit that the president's call for an end to "bickering" and the charges of racism by some of his supporters are the natural reflex of people who are not used to hearing people disagree with them and who are determined to shut them up.

This comes naturally to liberals educated in our great colleges and universities, so many of which have speech codes whose primary aim is to prevent the expression of certain conservative ideas and which are commonly deployed for that purpose. (For examples, see the Website of the Foundation for Individual Rights in Education, which defends students of all political stripes.) Once the haven of free inquiry and expression, academia has become a swamp of stifling political correctness.

Similarly, the "mainstream media" -- the old-line broadcast networks, The New York Times, etc. -- present a politically correct picture of the world. The result is that liberals can live in a cocoon, an America in which seldom is heard a discouraging word. Conservatives, in contrast, find themselves constantly pummeled with liberal criticism, on campus, in news media, and in Hollywood TV and movies. They don't like it, but they've gotten used to it. Liberals aren't used to it and increasingly try to stamp it out.

(snip)

Actually, "mainstream media" are doing their friends in the Obama administration and the Democratic Party no favors, at least in the long run. Obama comes from one-party Chicago, and the House Democrats' nine top leadership members and committee chairmen come from districts that voted on average 73 percent for Obama last fall. They need help in understanding the larger country they are seeking to govern, where nearly half voted the other way. Instead, they get the impression they can dismiss critics as racist or "Nazis" or as indulging in (as Sen. Harry Reid said) "evil-mongering."

Speaker Nancy Pelosi has warned us that there's a danger that intense rhetoric can provoke violence, and no decent person wants to see harm come to our president or other leaders. But it's interesting that the two most violent incidents at this summer's town hall meetings came when a union thug beat up a 65-year-old black conservative in Missouri and when a liberal protester bit off part of a man's finger in California.

These incidents don't justify a conclusion that all liberals are violent. But they are more evidence that American liberals, unused to hearing dissent, have an impulse to shut it down.

foxyladi
09-21-2009, 12:54 PM
i,m taking my marbles..and going home:rotfl::rotfl:

CGP
09-21-2009, 08:28 PM
I trust that "the right" will welcome the Marriage Equality rally in DC in October and openly support the freedom of people to speak out against injustice and oppression - much of that at the hands of "the right". And I certainly hope they won't be branding & dismissing, with the "angry activist" smear, anyone who attends the rally.

mavfin
09-21-2009, 08:33 PM
I trust that "the right" will welcome the Marriage Equality rally in DC in October and openly support the freedom of people to speak out against injustice and oppression - much of that at the hands of "the right". And I certainly hope they won't be branding & dismissing, with the "angry activist" smear, anyone who attends the rally.

Well, this 'right' will happily welcome you to wherever for equality. I wish you luck. And usually activists don't rally unless they're angry about something. :D

WASTRIC
09-21-2009, 09:41 PM
see, another rally I want to go to in D.C. Be sure and take lots of photos so we can see the rally.

Maybe we need to move the US Capitol to someplace like Omaha or OK City where its more centered. That way us westerners can join in all these protests ;)

Valin
09-22-2009, 02:11 AM
I trust that "the right" will welcome the Marriage Equality rally in DC in October and openly support the freedom of people to speak out against injustice and oppression - much of that at the hands of "the right". And I certainly hope they won't be branding & dismissing, with the "angry activist" smear, anyone who attends the rally.

And what injustice and oppression would that be?

CGP
09-22-2009, 02:37 AM
And what injustice and oppression would that be?

Does it even need explaining? Obviously it does.

Same-sex couples cannot marry in every state of the USA. Many conservatives support this injustice.

Same-sex marriage is completely unrecognized by federal laws. Many conservatives support this injustice.

Same-sex couples are discriminated against by LAWS in a multitude of ways. Heard of that vile act call DOMA? Many conservatives support this injustice.

When people are not treated equally and are actively discriminated against, that equates to injustice and oppression. Please don't aggrevate me by trying to argue that same sex-couples are not treated in an unjust and oppressive manner in the USA.

Valin
09-22-2009, 02:47 AM
Does it even need explaining?

Same-sex couples cannot marry in every state of the USA.

Same-sex marriage is completely unrecognized by federal laws.

Both point are now irrelevant. Thanks to the Full Faith and Credit clause of the US Constitution. A marrige recognized in one state is legal in all 50.


I do wonder if people have ever heard of a little thing I like to call a "Contract"?

CGP
09-22-2009, 02:50 AM
A marrige recognized in one state is legal in all 50.


DOMA over-rides all of that.

Same-sex marriages are not recognized across all states.

Same-sex marriages are not recognized by federal laws.

mavfin
09-22-2009, 02:50 AM
Both point are now irrelevant. Thanks to the Full Faith and Credit clause of the US Constitution. A marrige recognized in one state is legal in all 50.


I do wonder if people have ever heard of a little thing I like to call a "Contract"?

Unfortunately, DOMA specifically excludes that clause, so unless it's tested in court, they aren't recognized in other states.

mack20
09-22-2009, 02:53 AM
Both point are now irrelevant. Thanks to the Full Faith and Credit clause of the US Constitution. A marrige recognized in one state is legal in all 50.


I do wonder if people have ever heard of a little thing I like to call a "Contract"?

Uh, what?

CGP
09-22-2009, 02:58 AM
Both point are now irrelevant. Thanks to the Full Faith and Credit clause of the US Constitution. A marrige recognized in one state is legal in all 50.


I do wonder if people have ever heard of a little thing I like to call a "Contract"?

http://www.hrc.org/issues/5443.htm

What the Defense of Marriage Act Does


The so-called Defense of Marriage Act, or DOMA, purports to give states the "right" to refuse to recognize same-sex marriages performed in other states. A number of authorities, including Laurence Tribe, a Harvard University law professor, have challenged the constitutionality of such a move. The full faith and credit clause of the U.S. Constitution requires states to recognize the "acts, records and proceedings" of all other states. For example, marriages performed today in Mississippi are considered valid in Wisconsin, Oregon, Arizona and every other state. Under this law, same-sex marriages that are legal in one state may or may not be legal in another state.

DOMA also creates a federal definition of "marriage" and "spouse" for the first time in our country's history. This is an unprecedented intrusion by the U.S. Congress into an area traditionally left to the states. Marriage is defined as a "legal union between one man and one woman as husband and wife," and spouse is defined as "a person of the opposite sex who is a husband or a wife." Marriages that do not fit this description would not be eligible for any benefits offered by the federal government. Under DOMA, even if a state were to recognize same-sex marriages, the federal government would not. The people involved would be unable to receive a number of benefits, including those related to Social Security, survivorship and inheritance.

hobbitt
09-22-2009, 05:36 AM
Same-sex couples are discriminated against by LAWS in a multitude of ways. Heard of that vile act call DOMA? .


Dem President.
Dem House.
Dem Senate.


Get the federal laws changed.

There is a wealth of resources - names, addresses, telephone numbers, email addresses, for politicians and reporters available in the archives of some place [now] called CGP.

Organize and inspire your liberal friends to send the emails, make the calls, do the urging.


There might even be a few individuals still here, if they haven't gotten discouraged by the constant bleat of "bigot" and "racist" who have experience and would like to help.

I think there is also a guy here who organized a demonstration in NYC: he probably still remembers all the stuff about permits and such.


I forget his name, but I do remember that he described himself as a devastatingly handsome, intelligent, passionate Hillary supporter.

jlynne
09-22-2009, 02:02 PM
Both point are now irrelevant. Thanks to the Full Faith and Credit clause of the US Constitution. A marrige recognized in one state is legal in all 50.


I do wonder if people have ever heard of a little thing I like to call a "Contract"?

The Defense of Marriage Act suspends the Full Faith and Credit clause of the Constitution meaning that states that do not allow gay marriages do not have to recognize gay marriages performed in other states. For that reason, DOMA is most likely unconstitutional. But it is the ONLY thing stopping opponents of gay marriage from seeking a Constitutional Amendment to define marriage as between a man and a woman.

And, like it or not, gay rights have not progressed far enough in America to stop the majority of states from voting for just such an Amendment.

foxyladi
09-22-2009, 07:13 PM
equal rights for all:thumbsup::thumbsup: